Bending Wood Strips in 2 Planes

[Signet]

I'm building MarisStella's kit of the Ragusian Carrack, and like all 16th century and earlier ships, it has an extreme curve to the wales, strakes and planking, the bow in particular. The bow is almost completely circular when looked at from above (not unusual), but the wales and planking have a fairly extreme upward curve as well. The planking strips are 1.5x4mm, and bend fairly well on one direction (obviously), especially when soaked in water and heated. And they can be made to bend in the "hard" direction if held tightly to the hull or surface they're being bend against. But of course the bow of this mode has them bending in both ways. I realize that to an extent this type of double bend can be forced, but the inner (top) of the strip really wants to bow out to prevent a good fit. I've looked at some planking articles and books and they don't seem to address this particular problem.

Is there a method of doing this? My goal is to pre-bend strips to the proper profile before applying them. Easy direction - no problem. Hard direction, on top of easy direction, and I have no idea how to accomplish this. Should I soak and try bending the strips at the bow end the hard way first, let dry, then make the main curve? Will the first bend "unbend" when making the second one?

I would have thought that planks/strips should be applied and bent the "easy way" and just have them end up at the end at the height they end up at, without trying to bend them upwards as well. In fact, I would have thought that would be the way real ships would be made as well. But that is not how this ship, or the model of this ship, is apparently made. Any help or ideas about how to accomplish this would be appreciated.

 

[Y.T.]

This booklet will help.

 

[Signet]

This booklet will help.

Excellent booklet, thank you. It looks like it was designed around a hull with the design of my model, so I'm sure it will be very helpful. A skim of the text indicates not much information on bending as I had requested, but a lot of great information there, regardless.

 

[Y.T.]

It is very difficult if not impossible to bend the planks sideways. For large curves some modelers are cutting out a required plank profiles off the wood sheets. Proper way to do it is to taper the plank widths down. It is well described in this booklet.

 

[Don Case]

I use a household iron. I soak the wood for a few minutes and then holding the wood down flat with the iron I pull it out while lifting up and pulling sideways. There is a knack to it but you can get a bend in both directions. One caveat, I have only done this with Hazel which bends rather nicely, so your results may vary depending on which wood you are using.

 

[Signet]

I'm using strips of walnut 1.5x4mm in size. I thought I'd try a method, even though it may prove impractical. I intend to start out with the strake at the main deck height, from hull stem to stern, which is supposed to look like this pic of Olha Batchvarov's excellent build of this ship:

I took measurements along the hull length, and from the base to the top of the strake, and made a pattern for bending. I actually increased the curvature by 50%, knowing that the bent strips would return partly toward their straight position. I used nails and clamps to approximate the bend, soaked two strips in hot water, and positioned them bent the "wrong way" to dry:


After they dried, I found they came pretty close to the original outline desired (not increased by 50%):

While the strips seem to be maintaining their bend, I have no idea what will happen when I again soak and stem the forward portion to fit the stem curvature; they may lose some of their vertical bend. Guess I'll find out.

 

[dockattner]

I'm using strips of walnut 1.5x4mm in size. I thought I'd try a method, even though it may prove impractical. I intend to start out with the strake at the main deck height, from hull stem to stern, which is supposed to look like this pic of Olha Batchvarov's excellent build of this ship:
View attachment 363315
I took measurements along the hull length, and from the base to the top of the strake, and made a pattern for bending. I actually increased the curvature by 50%, knowing that the bent strips would return partly toward their straight position. I used nails and clamps to approximate the bend, soaked two strips in hot water, and positioned them bent the "wrong way" to dry:
View attachment 363313

After they dried, I found they came pretty close to the original outline desired (not increased by 50%):
View attachment 363314
While the strips seem to be maintaining their bend, I have no idea what will happen when I again soak and stem the forward portion to fit the stem curvature; they may lose some of their vertical bend. Guess I'll find out.

That’s my experience. When you reintroduce moisture the earlier bend fades away. But the wood seems happy to be forced back again as if it retains some memory. Have you figured out how you will get that first plank into place? CA? Pins? Clamps?

 

[Signet]

That’s my experience. When you reintroduce moisture the earlier bend fades away. But the wood seems happy to be forced back again as if it retains some memory. Have you figured out how you will get that first plank into place? CA? Pins? Clamps?

I think I'm going to give CA a try. This first plank will actually be covered by another, to form the rubbing strake, and I can place pins there if necessary. In fact, I intend to nail the rubbing strakes in place, but not the planking in between. If I do use foam, my thought is to still use CA on bulkheads, but place white glue in between to help attach strips to the foam. OTOH, the foam gets in the way of clamping, and may not be necessary (or desirable).

Oh, I just took a walnut strip and tried the Hobby Tools plank bender, and it did not bend the strip at all! I bought a different brand previously when I had the model kit Berlin, and it worked fantastic but sold the kit and gave the tool away with it. Don't know what's up with this one.

 

[Short John Bronze]

I found cutting shaped strips from a sheet of 1mm walnut for the second stage planking of the "Revenge" relatively easy, different and satisfying.
A Micky Mouse computer program printed out the necessary shapes to provide templates.

 

[OlivierF]

Are you familiar with Olha Batchvarov’s Facebook page? She has built this model and has several dedicated to it’s planking.
Olha Batchvarov Facebook

 

[Signet]

Are you familiar with Olha Batchvarov’s Facebook page? She has built this model and has several dedicated to it’s planking.
Olha Batchvarov Facebook

Yes, her article and video are why I'm building this model, in fact. I, however, don't have her skills, tools or patience, so am always looking for shortcuts for some tasks, planking it seems in particular.

 

[Bob Ellis]

I'm building MarisStella's kit of the Ragusian Carrack, and like all 16th century and earlier ships, it has an extreme curve to the wales, strakes and planking, the bow in particular. The bow is almost completely circular when looked at from above (not unusual), but the wales and planking have a fairly extreme upward curve as well. The planking strips are 1.5x4mm, and bend fairly well on one direction (obviously), especially when soaked in water and heated. And they can be made to bend in the "hard" direction if held tightly to the hull or surface they're being bend against. But of course the bow of this mode has them bending in both ways. I realize that to an extent this type of double bend can be forced, but the inner (top) of the strip really wants to bow out to prevent a good fit. I've looked at some planking articles and books and they don't seem to address this particular problem.

Is there a method of doing this? My goal is to pre-bend strips to the proper profile before applying them. Easy direction - no problem. Hard direction, on top of easy direction, and I have no idea how to accomplish this. Should I soak and try bending the strips at the bow end the hard way first, let dry, then make the main curve? Will the first bend "unbend" when making the second one?

I would have thought that planks/strips should be applied and bent the "easy way" and just have them end up at the end at the height they end up at, without trying to bend them upwards as well. In fact, I would have thought that would be the way real ships would be made as well. But that is not how this ship, or the model of this ship, is apparently made. Any help or ideas about how to accomplish this would be appreciated.

A couple of methods. You can use a home made jig for edge bending. Edge bending is the only truly essential bend a plank requires. The only tools available cannot do this, so all are a waste on money. Using 1mm planking the plank can be soaked and set on your jig. Note that the bend curves DOWNWARDS at the stem! Have a dry fit to see if it needs adjustment. When fixing start at the stem, I use CN, let it set then the plank can be coaxed onto the next fixing point without pre bending.
Alternatively you can soak the plank and clamp into position on the hull so that it sets with all curves and twists. You may find this better for 1.5mm planks.

 

[danielsje]

One approach I tried was to use a very long plank…longer than needed…a long plank can be curved better…then measure and clip off one end…glue the end down…then work back along the plank gluing at each bulkhead point.
It worked but I don’t think the curve requirement was very severe.
I suggest using CA gel for the adhesive for these compound curved planks. The gel does not whick into the wood quickly allowing for good quick adhesion…

 

[Signet]

A couple of methods. You can use a home made jig for edge bending. Edge bending is the only truly essential bend a plank requires. The only tools available cannot do this, so all are a waste on money. Using 1mm planking the plank can be soaked and set on your jig. Note that the bend curves DOWNWARDS at the stem!

Thanks for the photos and information. Interesting that you mention the bend curves downwards at the stem, as it is definitely the case on my model that it curves upwards at both ends. No doubt a more modern model has planking that ends up more parallel with the waterline than on this ship, and therefore the downward curvature is required.

 

[dockattner]

Thanks for the photos and information. Interesting that you mention the bend curves downwards at the stem, as it is definitely the case on my model that it curves upwards at both ends. No doubt a more modern model has planking that ends up more parallel with the waterline than on this ship, and therefore the downward curvature is required.

You may need to introduce a downward bend to pre shape a plank that goes onto the ship with a slight upward curve. The more bluff/rounded the bow or stern the more this will be true. Not intuitive but true.

 

[Jack Sparrow]

I'm using strips of walnut 1.5x4mm in size. I thought I'd try a method, even though it may prove impractical. I intend to start out with the strake at the main deck height, from hull stem to stern, which is supposed to look like this pic of Olha Batchvarov's excellent build of this ship:
View attachment 363315
I took measurements along the hull length, and from the base to the top of the strake, and made a pattern for bending. I actually increased the curvature by 50%, knowing that the bent strips would return partly toward their straight position. I used nails and clamps to approximate the bend, soaked two strips in hot water, and positioned them bent the "wrong way" to dry:
View attachment 363313

After they dried, I found they came pretty close to the original outline desired (not increased by 50%):
View attachment 363314
While the strips seem to be maintaining their bend, I have no idea what will happen when I again soak and stem the forward portion to fit the stem curvature; they may lose some of their vertical bend. Guess I'll find out.

This is what I do too, but with the addition of using an iron to set the curve in place, if this makes any sense.

 

[Bob Ellis]

Thanks for the photos and information. Interesting that you mention the bend curves downwards at the stem, as it is definitely the case on my model that it curves upwards at both ends. No doubt a more modern model has planking that ends up more parallel with the waterline than on this ship, and therefore the downward curvature is required.

You can check the curve direction by looking along the plank from the stern. Although the plank appears to curve upwards from a side view this is distorted by the bow curve as seen on plan from above. Whichever case the second method (preferable to you since they are 1.5 mm planks) Will set into the correct position. (I would be surprised if they turn up!) ie. The planks shown here curve downwards!!

 

[Sfrank]

This booklet will help.

Hi, and thank you for the booklet but there seems to be something wrong with the link. Any chance you could repost it?

 

[Signet]

After soaking the two starting planks, and positioning them in a jig to bend them sideways and upwards at each end, I today positioned and glued them in place. Doing the horizontal bend at the bow on each piece may have straightened the pieces somewhat vertically, in fact just placing the ends in water may have done some of that. So while positioning and gluing them in place, I had to force a good bit more upward curve at the bow end. The aft end bends upwards as well, but with a much more gradual curve, so no problem there. Here's a pic of one of the planks in its final location, at the main deck level:

I mostly used white glue here, as it adheres well to the foam as well, but also went back and using CA in certain places to insure a good bond.

I have other photos on my build log which you may want to check out at MarisStella Ragusian Carrack by Signet.

I'm hoping that after properly locating this one plank on each side, that bending the remainder using it as a guide, and clamping tightly against it, will require less previous bending, especially if soaking it water and waiting overnight. As to gluing and clamping method, I'll work that out as I go along, I guess.