Don’t change that channel

[whiskers]

When attaching channels I think most modellers use glue and nails/screws. The channel is positioned against the side of the hull and affixed to a plank. Now on to my question.
When one makes furniture sometimes a part of the table, chair what have you is “let in” to another part of the piece. Has this ever been a practice when ships were built?
The use of this would certainly add strength to the channel, no?

John

 

[Philski]

When attaching channels I think most modellers use glue and nails/screws. The channel is positioned against the side of the hull and affixed to a plank. Now on to my question.
When one makes furniture sometimes a part of the table, chair what have you is “let in” to another part of the piece. Has this ever been a practice when ships were built?
The use of this would certainly add strength to the channel, no?

John

'Channels' as in wood working are typically put in dados. A continuous groove into which metal or plastic guides are inserted. I am not sure how channels are used in model wooden ships. Picture?

 

[neptune]

,
'Channels' as in wood working are typically put in dados. A continuous groove into which metal or plastic guides are inserted. I am not sure how channels are used in model wooden ships. Picture?

Phil, John is talking about the Fore, Main and Mizzen Channels that are attached to the side of a ship that hold the dead eyes,

Best regards John,

 

[Philski]

Phil, John is talking about the Fore, Main and Mizzen Channels that are attached to the side of a ship that hold the dead eyes,

Best regards John,

I am still on my first build so 'channels' on a hull is new to me. But have cut thousands of dados. I can imagine trying to groove a hull for some type of channeling.

 

[neptune]

I am still on my first build so 'channels' on a hull is new to me. But have cut thousands of dados. I can imagine trying to groove a hull for some type of channeling.

A couple of pics of the channels on my cross section, they are fixed against the side of the ship to hold the dead eyes and also keep the shrouds away from the side of the ship,









Hope this helps clarify things,

best regards John,

.

 

[neptune]

When attaching channels I think most modellers use glue and nails/screws. The channel is positioned against the side of the hull and affixed to a plank. Now on to my question.
When one makes furniture sometimes a part of the table, chair what have you is “let in” to another part of the piece. Has this ever been a practice when ships were built?
The use of this would certainly add strength to the channel, no?

John

G'day John, they probably were either let in or maybe even fixed to the framing before attaching the planking, its a good question,

best regards john,

 

[whiskers]

G'day John, they probably were either let in or maybe even fixed to the framing before attaching the planking, its a good question,

best regards john,

Attached to the framing. I think you have answered the question. From a stability and strength standpoint that makes perfect sense. Thanks for your input. That has always been in my mind.

 

[Uwek]

according my knowledge, the channels had no direct contact with the frames. The frames were completely covered with planking and the channels had only cotact with the planks.
I tried to make a skecth showing the principles



braun - frame
black - planking
blue - channel
green - knee
orange - shrouds
purple - iron bolts
red arrows - the forces produced by the shoruds

from static point of view:
The shrouds are producing only tension - because of this tension they are pressing the channel against the planking - so the channels are getting only pressure and this can take over by the planking (and indirect the frames)
In order to keep the channels in place, so not moving upwards or downwards or getting some lifting at the outer end by forces from the shrouds - they were fixed by wooden knees which were bolted through the planking against the frames.

So in my opinion the channels had no direct contact with frames - but only with the planks
Also with this you have a better watertightness and no additional joints.

 

[Uwek]

here is also a cross section which I found - missing are the knees

 

[Dave Stevens (Lumberyard)]

in some cases the inside edge of a channel rest against the frame and rods are driven in through the frame and into the channel. Looking at the right side it looks like the channel goes into a slot between the planking



channels are also held in place with knees or some sort of supports you can see two pillar type of supports under the channel



i have noticed a plank the same width as the thickness of the channel like the yellow plank in the first photo and in the second photo there is a molding above the channel and a narrow plank under the molding which seems to fill the gap from the molding to the planking below this kind of indicates the channel is sitting in a slot between planks.

 

[danielsje]

Another consideration is to note the stress directions of a channel board. The stress is not typically up and down but inward to the hull. The job of the channel is to push the dead eyes out from the hull to gain proper angle to the stays. When anchored, there would be little to no up and down stress but rather stress into the hull. Thus rarely would one see channel braces to limit up and down stress movement.

 

[Dave Stevens (Lumberyard)]

i would agree with Uwek that the channel rested against the hull planking. Looking at this photo from a wreck the channel is missing but there is no slot in the hull planking so it is reasonable to say the channel rested against the planking.

 

[Thomas]

Another consideration is to note the stress directions of a channel board. The stress is not typically up and down but inward to the hull. The job of the channel is to push the dead eyes out from the hull to gain proper angle to the stays. When anchored, there would be little to no up and down stress but rather stress into the hull. Thus rarely would one see channel braces to limit up and down stress movement.

True--unlike a ship model where there will be lots of upward stress!

 

[Don Case]

True--unlike a ship model where there will be lots of upward stress!

Why would a model be different than the original. If the chain plates are strongly attached it should be the same. Near as I can figure the channels are just spreaders. Really low spreaders, but spreaders.

 

[Thomas]

Why would a model be different than the original. If the chain plates are strongly attached it should be the same. Near as I can figure the channels are just spreaders. Really low spreaders, but spreaders.

It's probably an engineering question, which is beyond me! I was thinking about what Jim said, that on an actual ship, the stress on the channels would be inward as the masts and sails were impacted by the wind. The only stress on a ship model would be upward as you tighten the deadeye reeving. Failure to firmly attach the channels can have really depressing results! (Don't ask me how I know that.)