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1:48 scale cannon and carronades: Dimensions etc

I

IntrepidBear

Joined
Jul 26, 2024
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Hi,

Could anyone point me in the direction for finding the dimensions of the following please:

18 Pdr Long Gun dimensions
9 Pdr Long Gun Dimensions:
32 Pdr Carronade Dimensions:
18 Pdr Carronade Dimensions:
12 Pdr Carronade Dimensions:
3 Pdr Swivel gun dimensions:
2 Pdr Swivel gun dimensions

And relevant ball or ammunition

I don't believe that anyone produces 1:48 scale variants, so i will probably need to work out how to do so myself. Any thoughts would be great!

Cheers
James
 
IntrepidBear said:
Could anyone point me in the direction for finding the dimensions of the following please:
Click to expand...
Super welcome to SOS James. :)

Keep in mind each caliber of the long guns came in several lengths. Couple questions
What nation's guns are you looking for?
If these are to be English, which long gun patterns are you interested in? There were seven between 1625 and into the first part of the 19th century, from Pitt to Blomefields and they all have a different pattern design. If you have a specific year in mind, that would narrow it down. As you are also interested in Carronades, I am guessing late 18th century or into the 19th century.
There were also variations in the carriages over time to keep in mind.
For making guns, have you read the thread here at SoS https://shipsofscale.com/sosforums/threads/making-cannon.14545/
Sorry for the questions, but if you could narrow down your needs, that would be great.

If you had scaled drawings would that work for you? Examples are below. The first is a carronade drawing from Adrian Caruana's book The History of English Sea Ordnance, volume 2.

There are 3D drawings available if you are interested in having the barrels printed in resin rather than metal.

Allan
1749634295347.jpeg
1749634483836.jpeg
 

Attachments

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Allan,

Thanks, that's great, I can be more specific, they are for HMS Phoebe (1795) as at 1812. The SQ and log of 1812 suggests as below, does this help?:

16 Mar 1795 changed 6pdrs to 9 pdrs
Admiralty Order (AO) 4 June 1799 to have all carr on QD and FC except 2 long chase guns (9 pdrs) on FC.
25 Jan 1813 reported to have: 2 x 9s and 12 x 32 carr QD and 2 x 9s and 2 x 32 carr FC
28 Aug 1815 reported to have: 26 x 18s (short) UD; 12 x 32 carr QD and 4 x 9pdr and 2 x 32 carr FC.
18 pdrs @ 8 feet and 37 cwt
18 and 12 pdr launch carronades on high angle carriages
9 Pdrs Chase @ 7 feet 6 inches
Swivels in tops
18 Pdr Long Gun dimensions:
9 Pdr Long Gun Dimensions:
32 Pdr Carronade Dimensions:
18 Pdr Carronade Dimensions:
12 Pdr Carronade Dimensions:
3 Pdr Swivel gun dimensions:
2 Pdr Swivel gun dimensions
18 pdr ball
9 pdr ball
32 pd ball
12 pd ball

HMS Phoebe SQ 1812.jpg
 
IB,
Do you have a CAD program? If you do, please PM me and I can send 3D drawings of the 9 pounder and 18 pounder Blomefields. If not, are 2D examples above OK for you to work with? The 3D drawings do not seem to work as attachments here.

For the lengths, this may be guesswork as they are not shown in the Phoebe list above. Note that the designated length of guns was from the muzzle to the breech ring, not the overall length.

I have a full contemporary contract for a 36 dated 12 November 1798 that may be of interest as well if you do not already have one.

2D drawings of 18 pounder Blomefields and Blomefield carriages below. For the 9 pounders, will the drawing in the post above in 2D be OK?

1749662397373.jpeg


Carronade table of lengths, from Volume 2 of The History of English Sea Ordnance by Adrian Caruana
1749662618037.jpeg

From pages 187 and 190 Volume 2 of The History of English Sea Ordnance by Caruana
32 pounder
1749663436725.png
18 pounder and 12 pounder
1749663493744.png
Apologies, but I have nothing on swivel guns after about 1730.

Allan
 
Thanks, will PM, with email, i have a copy of the Phoebe contract, i persuaded the RMG to scan it and publish online for me.

James
 
Hello James,
Do you need British, french or others...
If you are interested in the french armamant, I have redesigned most of the guns/carronades
of the french navy for the period 1780-1850 according to the book of Jean BOUDRIOT
"Artillerie de mer France 1650-1860" at scale 1:25 and 1:25. The book is available at
"ANCRE" publishing (France). As far as the drawings are concerned I can upload an example
on this thread.
Awaiting to hear from you
Denis
 
IntrepidBear said:
I don't believe that anyone produces 1:48 scale variants, so i will probably need to work out how to do so myself. Any thoughts would be great!
Click to expand...
Hello James, I can scale up my resin-printed Victory sets (link below), just pm me if you want to discuss.
 
Thanks, i am interested in British, c 1795-1813: 18 Pounder (*ft), 9 Pdr Chase (7ft6 In) and 9 Pdr (7ft). Allan has very kindly sent me some wonderful drawings but any more are always appreciated.

Thanks
James
 
Hello again James,
There are noticable differences between British and French armamant. The only British weapon that I can send is
the 69 Pounder Carronade of the Victory which I redesigned according to several publications such as
"Nelson`s Ships" (Nepean Longridge) but at scale 1:96.
Would it be useful to you?
Regards
Denis
 
Denis,

Very kind, i have no 69 Pdr carronades on Phoebe.

Really appreciate the assistance.

Regards
James
 
IntrepidBear said:
Hi,

Could anyone point me in the direction for finding the dimensions of the following please:

18 Pdr Long Gun dimensions
9 Pdr Long Gun Dimensions:
32 Pdr Carronade Dimensions:
18 Pdr Carronade Dimensions:
12 Pdr Carronade Dimensions:
3 Pdr Swivel gun dimensions:
2 Pdr Swivel gun dimensions

And relevant ball or ammunition

I don't believe that anyone produces 1:48 scale variants, so i will probably need to work out how to do so myself. Any thoughts would be great!

Cheers
James
Click to expand...
I noticed you don't have 4-pounders mentioned, but I am sure Dave from the Lumberyard for Model Ship Builders will be able to help you out. Goto their site and order away.
Saying this I have made my own up and when I make my log up for my Build for the Bounty, I will include them also and how I went about making them. I turned them out of Brass using the version of "The Anatomy of the Ship, The Armed Transport Bounty by John McKay. I naturally had to scale them down from 1:32 to 1:48 scale and work on those measurements. My lathe is over 100 years old but the bearings have been modified by me so I can do fine stuff. No fancy stuff here as I am on a budget. Pics included here are some of the Cannons and also the jig I used to drill an offset hole for the trunnions off the centre line of the cannon. It actually worked, and worked well.
The cannons look a bit out, but you can do what you can only do, but at actual size, they look just ok for turning by hand. The cannons are 1.5" long. Also, they are static models and hence the hole that goes right through the brass for the Trunnion location.
You know, anything can be done and all it takes is time.
With the jig when making it I had to produce the same taper as the cannon and used a pin reamer to do that as very close to same size . I then cut the steel using jeweler's Saw and had to step the cuts. It does not matter if you make bad cuts but long as they do the function of mating up afterward. I have also put a base flat surface on the jig so when mounting it for drilling of hole using the lathe, like a milling machine to get the height etc was also done perfectly.
To do this work from Scratch, as you can gather, takes a long time to do.

20250523_114801.jpg

20250527_172318.jpg

20250529_082801.jpg
 
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Those are some fine looking cannons in 1/48 scale! Thumbsup
How did you ream out the breach wider than the barrel opening?
If you cut the ends and then put them on again, it is impossible to tell.
 
Many thanks, i was looking at a specific ships armament, i just need to confirm exactly what variants were onboard. I went to the Lumberyard site, and the Long 18's and 9 Pdr match my figures but the 9 Pdr Long does not match any figures i have. So more research is required. Many thanks, James
 
Allegheny said:
Those are some fine looking cannons in 1/48 scale! Thumbsup
How did you ream out the breach wider than the barrel opening?
If you cut the ends and then put them on again, it is impossible to tell.
Click to expand...
If you are talking about the jig part: As the hole for the trunnions is offset on the diameter, I had to cut above the centre line of the Jig on one cut to miss the offset hole of the Jig for the trunnions offset hole. Now all I had to do so that the cannon would sit is is file a very small chamfer on the offset cut edge to let the cannon sit in. Maybe a bit hard to understand still? Let me know.
I have also forgotten to let you know I drilled two holes in this jig, and one is on center, and the off-center hole is for the Trunnion hole. Unfortunately, I did not drill the second hole through for the trunnion, but I drilled it deep enough to pass through the cannon into the jig when making the jig. Hope that makes sense.
 
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Well, I seem to have finalised the requirement:
18 Pdr Short Gun dimensions @ 8 ft and c 37 cwt (1:48 scaled c 51mm)
9 Pdr Gun Dimensions @ 7 feet and c 23 1/2 cwt (1:48 scaled c 45 mm)
9 Pdr Chase Gun Dimensions @ 7 ft 6 inches and 24 1/2 cwt (1:48 scaled c 48 mm)
32 Pdr Carronade Dimensions @ c 4 ft and 17 cwt (1:48 scaled c 25mm)
18 Pdr Carronade Dimensions @ 3ft 3 inches and 10 cwt (1:48 scaled c 21 mm)
12 Pdr Carronade Dimensions @ 2 ft 8 inches and 6 1/4 cwt (1:48 scaled c 17mm)
3 Pdr Main Top gun dimensions: tbc
2 Pdr Fore Top gun dimensions: tbc

Thank you all for you advice,
Cheers
James
 
Allan,

Agh ! Thanks, i have found what the crew at the time and both Gardiner and White (AOTS-Diana) call an 8 ft 18 pounder not to be confused with a longer version. All i need do now as you say is to look at the actual dimensions of what they mean by 8 ft etc based on Lavery etc. As you say 8 ft must be a muzzle to breech rather than overall. i just need now to calculate overall to see if any pre-made cannon is suitable! Ah the joys of scratch build. Steep learning curve again.

Cheers
James
 
Allan, so you are suggesting that the 7 ft 9 Pdr is actually 7ft 9 1/2 inches end to end length., and at 1:48 scale metric would be c 50mm end to end length?
 
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