Billing Boats USS Constitution confusion

[Svbwannab]

Hello!
Im starting to rig my model but am having a very difficult time figuring out all of the rigging ‘routes’. The illustrations arent very clear with some of the details. I’ve been searching the web for photos but other than a very nice build log in Model Ship World I’ve been unable to find photos of the yards which im currently working on. Im wondering if anyone has or knows of a resource, website or photos of this model that may help to clear up my confusion. Thank you!

 

[Corsair]

Congrats on your first post.
You might pick up the "Anatomy of the Ship" book on the Constitution. You can get it pretty reasonable and it's a decent source. One challenge is that the ship has been "updated" many times, so one question will be which "version" (date) are you building to if differing from the kit.
The book I mentioned looks like this:

 

[AllanKP69]

if anyone has or knows of a resource, website or photos

Have you contacted Dr. Carl Herzog at the Constitution Museum to see what they have that might help? He has been extremely responsive to questions in my experience. I will not post his email address on a public forum which can create headaches but you can reach out to him and the curator staff through their website.
www.ussconstitutionmuseum.org

Allan

 

[Svbwannab]

Congrats on your first post.
You might pick up the "Anatomy of the Ship" book on the Constitution. You can get it pretty reasonable and it's a decent source. One challenge is that the ship has been "updated" many times, so one question will be which "version" (date) are you building to if differing from the kit.
The book I mentioned looks like this:
View attachment 580266

Thank you for this reply and info. I just ordered this book! After spending much time flipping back and forth between Billing Boats illustrations along with photos found on the internet to (attempt) create a mental 3-D model, I pretty much came to the conclusion that I’d be ‘winging it’ in many cases. This book appears to be what the doctor ordered and a good companion to the finished product display! Thank you again!

 

[Svbwannab]

Have you contacted Dr. Carl Herzog at the Constitution Museum to see what they have that might help? He has been extremely responsive to questions in my experience. I will not post his email address on a public forum which can create headaches but you can reach out to him and the curator staff through their website.
www.ussconstitutionmuseum.org

Allan

Thank you for your reply! This looks like an excellent resource!

 

[AndyA]

Phil Bolger writes about designing the frigate (ship-sloop?) Rose in his book 30-Odd Boats. In designing the rigging, Bolger consulted with the Erik Ronnberg, Jr., Ronnberg's father, and the books The Anatomy of Nelson's Ships by Longridge and Way of a Ship by Villiers. Bolger points out that "The running rigging of square-riggers always tended to be changed around with every change of masters. There's a wide choice of unsatisfactory leads, some worse than others. To the best of my knowledge, there's no good way of doing it. There are too many leads to the mizzen topmast here. The main topsail and topgallant braces were soon shifted to the foremast and fore topmast caps, respectively." This leads me to think that we should be cautious about overanalyzing rigging details of historical vessels. Of course, research is important and is fun in itself but at some point a modeler must decide on the probable arrangement and carry on.

Rose was built in 1970 and was later transformed into the HMS Surprise for the filming of Master and Commander. Bolger was clear that she was not a replica but "a stage set rather than anything of historical significance in a technical sense." But she did sail. Fair winds!

 

[Svbwannab]

Phil Bolger writes about designing the frigate (ship-sloop?) Rose in his book 30-Odd Boats. In designing the rigging, Bolger consulted with the Erik Ronnberg, Jr., Ronnberg's father, and the books The Anatomy of Nelson's Ships by Longridge and Way of a Ship by Villiers. Bolger points out that "The running rigging of square-riggers always tended to be changed around with every change of masters. There's a wide choice of unsatisfactory leads, some worse than others. To the best of my knowledge, there's no good way of doing it. There are too many leads to the mizzen topmast here. The main topsail and topgallant braces were soon shifted to the foremast and fore topmast caps, respectively." This leads me to think that we should be cautious about overanalyzing rigging details of historical vessels. Of course, research is important and is fun in itself but at some point a modeler must decide on the probable arrangement and carry on.

Rose was built in 1970 and was later transformed into the HMS Surprise for the filming of Master and Commander. Bolger was clear that she was not a replica but "a stage set rather than anything of historical significance in a technical sense." But she did sail. Fair winds!

View attachment 580351

Heh heh I’ve kind of come to that conclusion myself in kind of ‘winging it’ as needed. I figure that when it’s all said and done there is a lot of rigging and it’ll look good even if it’s not accurate. Thank you for the reassurance on this!

 

[Rob444]

When i was rigging my admittedly simpler Constitution cross section. I found this book by Petersson very helpful. It consists mainly of pictures with very little description, but it did answer many of my questions.

Rigging Period Ship Models by Lennarth Petersson (2011 HC/DJ Illustrated) | eBay

Strong binding and clean inside. Pages 1-6 have some wrinkling to them. It was bugging me that the front flap had not been folded properly and it didn't fit correctly so I ended up taping it into place. Please see all sixteen photos and be sure to contact me with any questions. Thanks for looking.

www.ebay.com

Rob

 

[Magic Mike]

Welcome Svbwannab to the forums and greetings from Texas! Magic Mike

 

[Svbwannab]

Phil Bolger writes about designing the frigate (ship-sloop?) Rose in his book 30-Odd Boats. In designing the rigging, Bolger consulted with the Erik Ronnberg, Jr., Ronnberg's father, and the books The Anatomy of Nelson's Ships by Longridge and Way of a Ship by Villiers. Bolger points out that "The running rigging of square-riggers always tended to be changed around with every change of masters. There's a wide choice of unsatisfactory leads, some worse than others. To the best of my knowledge, there's no good way of doing it. There are too many leads to the mizzen topmast here. The main topsail and topgallant braces were soon shifted to the foremast and fore topmast caps, respectively." This leads me to think that we should be cautious about overanalyzing rigging details of historical vessels. Of course, research is important and is fun in itself but at some point a modeler must decide on the probable arrangement and carry on.

Rose was built in 1970 and was later transformed into the HMS Surprise for the filming of Master and Commander. Bolger was clear that she was not a replica but "a stage set rather than anything of historical significance in a technical sense." But she did sail. Fair winds!

View attachment 580351

Yes I think I’m finding this out, changes to the ship(s) as they aged and evolved. I’ve also decided that if I don’t rig it ‘perfectly’ it will still (hopefully) look good on display. The bottom line is that I’m very much enjoying this hobby! Thank you!

 

[Svbwannab]

Welcome Svbwannab to the forums and greetings from Texas! Magic Mike

Thank you Magic!

 

[Svbwannab]

When i was rigging my admittedly simpler Constitution cross section. I found this book by Petersson very helpful. It consists mainly of pictures with very little description, but it did answer many of my questions.

Rigging Period Ship Models by Lennarth Petersson (2011 HC/DJ Illustrated) | eBay

Strong binding and clean inside. Pages 1-6 have some wrinkling to them. It was bugging me that the front flap had not been folded properly and it didn't fit correctly so I ended up taping it into place. Please see all sixteen photos and be sure to contact me with any questions. Thanks for looking.

www.ebay.com

Rob

Thank you Rob!

 

[swampdweller126]

Hello and welcome to the forum, from NY