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A beautiful discovery

Ettienne

Ettienne

Joined
May 31, 2021
Messages
362
Points
168

Location
Kommetjie, Western Cape, South Africa
Good morning to all.
Kleinmond is a average size sea side town in the Western Cape Province. It also has a small gem of a second hand bookshop, Oupa's [Grandpa in english] Books. For it's size it has quite a substantial military history and war history collection. When trying to find some books on naval and maritime history I found these two gems. And I just had to buy them - of course. Any one has more information on them?

Old Navy Books.jpg
 
Happy New Year!!
I don't know anything about "the Model Shipbuilder", but I own a copy of "the Tall Frigates".
I like it a lot, but it's not your usual reference book...it has tons of good information, written in the form of a novel. It makes for an enjoyable read!
 
Happy New Year 'E'.

As you say, finding that bookshop is a minor miracle these days.
Many happy times I've had browsing such establishments; the unexpected discovery of unheard of titles and encountering new, interesting topics can be a thrill.

Happy hunting.
 
pugwash said:
Happy New Year 'E'.

As you say, finding that bookshop is a minor miracle these days.
Many happy times I've had browsing such establishments; the unexpected discovery of unheard of titles and encountering new, interesting topics can be a thrill.

Happy hunting.
Click to expand...
And a kind and peaceful 2026 to you too my friend. Yes, it was quite a discovery as books on maritime and naval history in South Africa is relatively scarce. And in a way we are a maritime people ...That is how we arrived here in the first place.
 
Myhr99 said:
Happy New Year!!
I don't know anything about "the Model Shipbuilder", but I own a copy of "the Tall Frigates".
I like it a lot, but it's not your usual reference book...it has tons of good information, written in the form of a novel. It makes for an enjoyable read!
Click to expand...
I am really looking forward to the read. But ... I need to finish Peter Bagshawe's Warriors of the Sky, Springbok Air Heroes in Combat from the series South Africans at War.
 
Here we go.

I noticed the author of 'The Model Shipbuilder' was 'former keeper of ship models' at the Science Museum, London; so presumably knew his stuff.

Further research reveals he was appointed to lead the survey team at the Sutton Hoo Anglo Saxon ship burial excavation, 1939, which opens an entirely new can of worms/rabbit hole
 
pugwash said:
Here we go.

I noticed the author of 'The Model Shipbuilder' was 'former keeper of ship models' at the Science Museum, London; so presumably knew his stuff.

Further research reveals he was appointed to lead the survey team at the Sutton Hoo Anglo Saxon ship burial excavation, 1939, which opens an entirely new can of worms/rabbit hole
Click to expand...
Well ... again some very interesting information to create beautiful context. Thanks Pug. Oh, the Russians, Chinese, Iranese and UAE ships arrived yesterday in Simons' Town and Cape Town Harbour. Exitement all around (not always for the same reason). I will post some pictures on the site during the weekend.
 
Ettienne said:
Well ... again some very interesting information to create beautiful context. Thanks Pug. Oh, the Russians, Chinese, Iranese and UAE ships arrived yesterday in Simons' Town and Cape Town Harbour. Exitement all around (not always for the same reason). I will post some pictures on the site during the weekend.
Click to expand...
Are your 'visitors' in warships?
 
pugwash said:
Are your 'visitors' in warships?
Click to expand...
Yes she ships from Iran, Russia, the UAE and China are indeed warships and their supply vessels. South Africa is part of BRICS. A conglomeration of countries (Brasil, Russia, India, China and South Africa) similar to the of the EU and NATO. The Americans and especially Mr Trumpelmann (Trump) do not like that very much. The naval exercise here at the Southern point of Africa is to put some pressure on the United States influence within the SouthEastern Hemisphere. Or at least to show the US that someone is willing to challenge it. Not too long and the Chinese navy will be able to compete with the USN navy as the "strongest" navy in the world. Combine that with the Russian and Indian Fleet the situation in the east and southeast may become quite uncomfortable for US geopolitics. I am quite sure that China will start to put pressure on the US-Taiwan relationship. China has not buried her interest in Taiwan.

I took some screenshots and pictures of the activity around Simons' Town and False Bay. Not too great, but hey here theyy are. I do now that a Chinese Frigate arrived on Friday as well as a Russian Corvette together with supply ship. The vessel, in the blurry picture, is an Iranian Command vessel and Helicopte/Drone platform. What is really needed here to have a significant geoplolitical effect are Russian and Chinese submarines, as well as a Russian Aircraft carrier.

Brics IV.jpg

Brics III.jpg

Brics Nav II.jpg
 
At last. I have started and made quite some progress with "The tall Frigates". A really enjoyable read. On some pages the style of writing and narrative remind me of the "Pirate books and their battles" I read when I was a kid. Oh where were those days? Nice to read a book where one can have the joyful memories about that time and has the oppertunity to again experience the thrill. I am now on the pages where the American Frigates are giving the RN a bit of a hammering. Very interesting information. Oh and there is a chapter called "How to sail a frigate". One never knows, that information may come in quite handy one day ... Ship-1 ;)
 
Ettienne - Are there good maritime museums in South Africa? One of my interests is in 17th century Dutch commercial and naval vessels and I've read alot about the Dutch waystation in Cape Town for Dutch VOC (East India Company) ships en route to Jakarta / Batavia and back. I suppose this colony is connected with the Boer who helped to settle the areas outside Cape Town. Any recommendations for maritime museums and/or websites in your country?
 
Ignatius27 said:
Ettienne - Are there good maritime museums in South Africa? One of my interests is in 17th century Dutch commercial and naval vessels and I've read alot about the Dutch waystation in Cape Town for Dutch VOC (East India Company) ships en route to Jakarta / Batavia and back. I suppose this colony is connected with the Boer who helped to settle the areas outside Cape Town. Any recommendations for maritime museums and/or websites in your country?
Click to expand...
I will have a look and explore waht may be available. What we do have where I live is a decent Navy Museum (sanavymuseum.co.za), as well as a museum dedicated to one of our submarines (SAS Assegaai), previously known as the SAS Johanna van der Merwe (Penant 99). Usually early maritime history is everso briefly covered in the Navy Museum and other museums that there may be. There is no museum as far as I know, dedicated spesifically to the area ofyour interest. You may find some reference to SA's early maritime history at the musem at the Castle (https://castleofgoodhope.co.za/). The reason why our early maritime history is not covered well and even frowned upon is related to politics, but that is another topic. But I will stay in touch.
 
There is also a museum in Kwa-Zulu Natal, but that one is mostly dedicated to Natal's maritime history and on their website this description is given " Portside museum housing exhibits of local maritime significance as well as early exploration."
And here is an overview of about all the maritime museums that there are (apparently).

1785838237512.png

But know you have set another interest going - maritime museums. When I do find one that may be of interest I will let you know.
 
I have also seen these book, that could be helpful...

· The Cape of Good Hope: A Maritime History by Robin Knox-Johnston: Explores four centuries of trade, legendary sea routes, and early explorations around southern Africa.

· Maritime South Africa: A Pictorial History by Brian Ingpen and Robert Pabst: Offers a visual and factual overview of the country’s shipping, ports, and naval development.

· Shipwreck! by Jose Burman: A classic regional study highlighting the treacherous nature of South Africa's coastline and famous losses at sea. [1]

· Wood, Iron and Steel by Bruce Henderson and Graeme Kelly: Details 60 prominent shipwrecks off the Western Cape from the late 1600s onward, complete with mapping and technical data
 
Ettienne said:
You are most welcome sir. In the meantime I will explore what we have here in SA and if I do stumble across a book of possible interest I will let you know.
Click to expand...
Thanks Ettienne! My main interests lie in Dutch settlement of the areas between the Cape of Good Hope, Table Bay and Cape Agulhas beginning in the early 1600's. I know the history goes even further back to Bartolomeu Dias in the late 1400's, but my historical focus (in addition to my maritime focus) is the European settlement of Cape Town and surrounding areas up to the Boer Wars.

In addition to the excellent book you recommended, "The Cape of Good Hope: A Maritime History" by Robin Knox-Johnston, which I've already ordered from Amazon, I found the following tome which will help me study historic military conflicts on the South Africa mainland. Also ordered from Amazon.

Amazon.com: Assegais, Drums & Dragoons: A Military And Social History Of The Cape eBook : Steenkamp, Willem: Kindle Store

Assegais, Drums & Dragoons: A Military And Social History Of The Cape - Kindle edition by Steenkamp, Willem. Download it once and read it on your Kindle device, PC, phones or tablets. Use features like bookmarks, note taking and highlighting while reading Assegais, Drums & Dragoons: A Military...
www.amazon.com

Many thanks and wishing you fair winds and following seas!
 
Ignatius27 said:
Thanks Ettienne! My main interests lie in Dutch settlement of the areas between the Cape of Good Hope, Table Bay and Cape Agulhas beginning in the early 1600's. I know the history goes even further back to Bartolomeu Dias in the late 1400's, but my historical focus (in addition to my maritime focus) is the European settlement of Cape Town and surrounding areas up to the Boer Wars.

In addition to the excellent book you recommended, "The Cape of Good Hope: A Maritime History" by Robin Knox-Johnston, which I've already ordered from Amazon, I found the following tome which will help me study historic military conflicts on the South Africa mainland. Also ordered from Amazon.

Amazon.com: Assegais, Drums & Dragoons: A Military And Social History Of The Cape eBook : Steenkamp, Willem: Kindle Store

Assegais, Drums & Dragoons: A Military And Social History Of The Cape - Kindle edition by Steenkamp, Willem. Download it once and read it on your Kindle device, PC, phones or tablets. Use features like bookmarks, note taking and highlighting while reading Assegais, Drums & Dragoons: A Military...
www.amazon.com

Many thanks and wishing you fair winds and following seas!
Click to expand...
Good morning.

Your interest in in this particular history warms the heart. Ina a book about the South African navy the author observe that many south africans are closely related to our maritime history over the years and van be describes as "people from the sea". Many twons an villiages along the South African coast has some sort of a relationship with the early history of the 14th - 17th centuary, and in many of them some obscure little museum or monument is related to that part of our history.

Yes, and then there are the two British invasions. One known as "The battle of Blaauwberg" and "The battle of Muizenberg". I am not too far from bothe locations. Muizenberg is very much "next door" and Blouberg (Blue Mountain bay) is about a 20 km drive (12.43 miles). Mountain in the name is the well known "Table Mountain" (Tefelberg in Afrikaans/Dutch).

Willem Steenkamp is one of my top ten authors and is well recognised was a historian. His views do not always sit comfortable with the more liberal part of the nation, but facts are important to him and to report history objectively not the "popular aspact" of it.
 
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