There is third drawing existing
In this polnish forum, the rooms were already once discussed - maybe this is helping
www.shipman.fora.pl
I have to check the ancre publications I have at home, where these layouts are published - maybe in one of these books
ancre.fr
ancre.fr
In this polnish forum, the rooms were already once discussed - maybe this is helping
KAJUTA KAPITANA - www.shipman.fora.pl
MODELARSTWO SZKUTNICZE - kolekcje zeszytowe i inne
I have to check the ancre publications I have at home, where these layouts are published - maybe in one of these books
The Saint-Philippe and the first-rates under Louis XIII to Louis XIV - Ancre
Book in format 22x31 cm of 184 pages with 150 photos or engravings of which 144 pages in color.They are eleven first rank and 22 second rank in 1672. Available
ancre.fr
THE SHIPS OF THE SUN KING - JC Lemineur - Ancre
THE SHIPS OF THE SUN KING J.C Lemineur The author presents the creation and evolution of Louis XIV’s navyin an historical context. The fruit of many long years of archivalresearch working with primary sources, its invaluable contents arean essential reference work of French naval history.
ancre.fr
Maybe Marc alias @Hubac’s Historian knows more and can help faster
Soleil Royal by Heller - an Extensive Modification and Partial Scratch-Build by Hubac’s Historian
Hello, Ships of Scale! My name is Marc LaGuardia, and for the past three years, I have been extensively bashing the Heller kit in an effort to transform it into what I believe is her re-fit appearance of 1689. The project exists in its entirely, here at Model Ship World...
shipsofscale.com
Thank you for your reply.There is third drawing existing
View attachment 384677 View attachment 384678 View attachment 384679
In this polnish forum, the rooms were already once discussed - maybe this is helping
KAJUTA KAPITANA - www.shipman.fora.pl
MODELARSTWO SZKUTNICZE - kolekcje zeszytowe i inne
I have to check the ancre publications I have at home, where these layouts are published - maybe in one of these books
The Saint-Philippe and the first-rates under Louis XIII to Louis XIV - Ancre
Book in format 22x31 cm of 184 pages with 150 photos or engravings of which 144 pages in color.They are eleven first rank and 22 second rank in 1672. Available
THE SHIPS OF THE SUN KING - JC Lemineur - Ancre
THE SHIPS OF THE SUN KING J.C Lemineur The author presents the creation and evolution of Louis XIV’s navyin an historical context. The fruit of many long years of archivalresearch working with primary sources, its invaluable contents arean essential reference work of French naval history.
Thank you for the link for the description of the cabins.
I have both books but they unfortunately don't have the cabin layout.
I did find two other related Le Soleil Royal cabin drawings one of the ceiling and the other maybe an earlier drawing of the l’Admiral cabin but again there’s no reference to where they come from.
Best Regards
Shaun
Just found out, that the sketches and layouts are signed by "No.15 "
fr.wikipedia.org
Hubert Champy Desclouzeaux was the `intendant' of the harbour at Brest and customarily sent Bérain plans of the ships that were to be decorated.
so I guess, that they were also made by Jean Berain the elder
There is a book existing:
Jean Berain the Elder (1640-1711) was a draughtsman and designer, painter and engraver of ornament, the artistic force in the Royal office of the Menus-Plaisirs du Roi where all the designs originated for court spectacle, from fêtes to funerals, and many designs for furnishings not covered by the Bâtiments du Roi.
thecarycollection.com
Gloriæ navales
www.google.at
Hubert Champy Desclouzeaux
Hubert Champy Desclouzeaux — Wikipédia
Hubert Champy Desclouzeaux was the `intendant' of the harbour at Brest and customarily sent Bérain plans of the ships that were to be decorated.
Design for the decoration of the stern of Le Foudroyant | Bérain, Jean (the Elder) | V&A Explore The Collections
Design for the decoration of the stern of Le Foudroyant, about 1693. Jean Bérain, 1640-1771.
collections.vam.ac.uk
so I guess, that they were also made by Jean Berain the elder
There is a book existing:
"Berain: Dessinateur Du Roi Soleil" 1986 DE LA GORCE, Jerome
by DE LA GORCE, JeromeJean Berain the Elder (1640-1711) was a draughtsman and designer, painter and engraver of ornament, the artistic force in the Royal office of the Menus-Plaisirs du Roi where all the designs originated for court spectacle, from fêtes to funerals, and many designs for furnishings not covered by the Bâtiments du Roi.
"Berain: Dessinateur Du Roi Soleil" 1986 DE LA GORCE, Jerome
DE LA GORCE, Jerome [159] pp. Editions Herscher 1986 14" x 10 7/8" Fine/ Fine Scroll Down for (15) Additional Scans: Jean Berain the Elder (1640-1711) was a draughtsman and designer, painter and engraver of ornament, the artistic force in the Royal office of the Menus-Plaisirs du Roi where all...
thecarycollection.com
seems that the sketches were part of a communication between Desclouzeaux and Navy Minister Colbert de Seignelay
everything during the refit period of the SR
en.wikipedia.org
everything during the refit period of the SR
Jean-Baptiste Colbert, Marquis de Seignelay - Wikipedia
These drawings represent both the pre-refit and post refit dimensions of the aft cabins in 1688/89. Originally, the ship must have been significantly more narrow at the stern because the transom widths at the main deck and quarter deck are appreciably less than the post refit drawings (6-window layout). If I remember correctly, the middle deck transom width is also less, as originally constructed.
The coffered ceiling is an exact recording, with accompanying description, of the ceiling as it first was. This ceiling was preserved and re-installed in the great cabin of the refit ship
That’s a nice reference for Berain, Uwek. I’ll have to look into picking up that title.
Thank you.Just found out, that the sketches and layouts are signed by "No.15 "
View attachment 384813
Gloriæ navales
www.google.at
View attachment 384812
Hubert Champy Desclouzeaux
Hubert Champy Desclouzeaux — Wikipédia
Hubert Champy Desclouzeaux was the `intendant' of the harbour at Brest and customarily sent Bérain plans of the ships that were to be decorated.
Design for the decoration of the stern of Le Foudroyant | Bérain, Jean (the Elder) | V&A Explore The Collections
Design for the decoration of the stern of Le Foudroyant, about 1693. Jean Bérain, 1640-1771.collections.vam.ac.uk
so I guess, that they were also made by Jean Berain the elder
There is a book existing:
"Berain: Dessinateur Du Roi Soleil" 1986 DE LA GORCE, Jerome
by DE LA GORCE, Jerome
Jean Berain the Elder (1640-1711) was a draughtsman and designer, painter and engraver of ornament, the artistic force in the Royal office of the Menus-Plaisirs du Roi where all the designs originated for court spectacle, from fêtes to funerals, and many designs for furnishings not covered by the Bâtiments du Roi.
"Berain: Dessinateur Du Roi Soleil" 1986 DE LA GORCE, Jerome
DE LA GORCE, Jerome [159] pp. Editions Herscher 1986 14" x 10 7/8" Fine/ Fine Scroll Down for (15) Additional Scans: Jean Berain the Elder (1640-1711) was a draughtsman and designer, painter and engraver of ornament, the artistic force in the Royal office of the Menus-Plaisirs du Roi where all...
I found these at the library
Berain : dessinateur du Roi Soleil / Jérôme de La Gorce ; préface de Jacques Thuillier
La Gorce, Jérôme de (författare)
Berain, Jean (medarbetare)
Paris : Herscher, 1986
Franska 159 s.
Jean I Berain, dessinateur de la Chambre et du Cabinet du roi (1640-1711)
[Illustr.]
Weigert, Roger Armand (författare)
Paris, 1937
Franska.
Reproduction complète de l'œuvre de Jean Bérain : époque Louis XIV / Armand Guérinet, éditeur.
Bérain, Jean, d.ä. 1637-1711 (författare)
Guérinet, Armand (utgivare)
Publicerad: Paris : Librairie d'Art Décoratif, [date of publication not identified]
Franska 114 plates (including t.-p.)
All the drawings relating to the Soleil Royal are compiled in the monograph
THE THREE-DECKER of the Chevalier DE TOURVILLE- 1680
https://ancre.fr/en/monograph/68-monographie-de-l-ambitieux-vaisseau-3-ponts-1680.html
Correct - sorry, that I did not think about this monograph, which I have in my library (french and also english) - if you need something from there, please tell me
We have a planset review here in SOS, which I made years ago
Planset review - THE THREE-DECKER of the Chevalier de TOURVILLE - LE TROIS-PONTS du Chevalier de TOURVILLE - L’AMBITIEUX - 1680" by Jean Boudriot
Planset Review: THE THREE-DECKER of the Chevalier de TOURVILLE LE TROIS-PONTS du Chevalier de TOURVILLE L’AMBITIEUX 1680 by Jean Boudriot Two volume set available in English, French or Italian language directly from ancre...
shipsofscale.com
Actually there are two pages which might be interesting (pages 70 - 71?) from the screen shot review of the book on youtube, showing the arrangement of lodgings on the three-decker.
Would you be able to help me with this?
I will check it in the evening, when I am at home.......
Hobbydoor, what sort of project do you have in mind, surrounding the aft cabins of SR? Also curious - does the book Berain, Desinateur du Roi Soleil have a significant number of plates devoted to his work for the navy?
Hubac’s Historian
The aft cabins is more of a research project for the moment. I'm looking to find as many 17th century ship cabins as possible, either as drawings, archaeological remains or descriptions. Having worked on the reconstruction of the great cabin and stern gallery of the Vasa of 1628, I would like to know more about other cabins.
The books are hopefully on their way to me, as they are on an inter-library loan from the Maritime Museum in Stockholm. As soon as I get them I shall take a look and let you know.
That is completely fascinating that you worked on the jigsaw puzzle otherwise known as Vasa. One contemporary resource that is truly remarkable is the internal description of the Royal Louis of 1668, found in Hyatt’s monograph of 1677, just before the ship’s first major refit. Hyatt takes you through the aft end of the ship, from the lower decks, up through the poop. He describes the internal ornamentals in great detail. Apparently, the ship was as splendid within as on her facade.
Also, If I remember correctly, some of the carved details of the Kronan’s aft cabins have been photographed on the sea floor.
Also, If I remember correctly, some of the carved details of the Kronan’s aft cabins have been photographed on the sea floor.
Thank you!
Here some interesting links
Kronan
The royal ship Kronan
At the County Museum in Kalmar, there is an exhibition about the royal ship Kronan, which is open all year round. The Kronan exhibition shows the finds from 40 years of marine archeological excavations. You will find, for example, Kronan's two gold coin treasures, one of which is Sweden's...
kalmarlansmuseum.se
Ship wreck museum
Vrak - Vrak – Museum of Wrecks
www.vrak.se
Vasa museum
Welcome to the Vasa Museum
Welcome to one of the most visited museums in Scandinavia and explore the world's only preserved 17th century ship. The ship Vasa capsized and sank in 1628. After 333 years on the sea bed she was salvaged and the voyage could continue.
www.vasamuseet.se
Naval museum
Marinmuseum
På land, på vatten - på riktigt! Upplev den svenska marinens historia på den vackra ön Stumholmen i Karlskrona. Välkommen!
www.marinmuseum.se
Thank you for these links. The Kronan site looks especially interesting, but it is not perfectly operational right now.
Here we are
I made photos of the pages with the Soleil Royal sketches, but also some additional pages, which can be also very interesting for you (attached pdf)
