Questions about possible first kit

[regex]

Hi, new guy here, wanted to ask for advice on picking out my first kit. What I'm most interested in the long-run would be historically accurate models that I can pile a bunch of fun details onto. For background, I have experience with plastic models, modifying pewter miniatures for wargames, building terrain, and general carpentry skills, and already have most of the tools I need. I think I'll need to secure some glue, clips, clamps, rubber-bands, one of those big cylinder tips for my soldering iron, and maybe a couple new files. No big deal there, that's a relatively minor set of purchases and I won't regret any of them in the long run. I do not have a rotary tool like a Dremel or Proxxon (possible future purchase) but I do have several cordless drills which might do in a pinch.

Anyway, I'm interested in the following models for my first kit:

OcCre San Juan - I do not really like the Polaris and have seen some discussion surrounding whether it's actually a "schooner" by hull. The San Juan appears to be a good alternative from the same company and looks like an interesting kit. My big issue here is scale, it's 1/70 (why not 1/72?) and I'm worried about the rigging being a pain in the rear for a first-time build.

OcCre Bounty Boat - I like this guy, it has good detail and the scale is a decent size. Biggest worry is possible planking on frame.

Model Shipways Armed Longboat - This looks like a fun kit but it is explicitly plank on frame (I guess the Bounty Boat is too). My worry here is that, from the build logs I've seen of other Model Shipways Longboats, the "frame" pieces look to start as "bulkheads" which must be cut down and I don't know if I have the tools to do that inside cutting in a precise manner.

Big question here is which one would probably be the best to start with or which one(s) would be best to avoid for the first kit? I'd be happy with any of them and will probably end up building at least two of them.

Hoping to eventually work my way up to that beautiful Mamoli Catalina but the planking absolutely looks like it requires solid experience, so that's a long-term goal. First things first.

Thanks in advance! There's so much on this site to be inspired by and I hope I can eventually contribute in even a small way.

 

[Pepite 1/60]

Hi, I think the best kit to build is the one you like best, regardless of its difficulty or complexity. The trick is to stop when you hit a serious stump, take your time to think the problem over, and go on when you have worked your mind around it. There is no shame in putting a too big project aside for a while and to take on something easier until you feel ready to go on with your 'dreamboat'. It's a hobby, not a job.

 

[Kurt Konrath]

Rigging is always a PIA, regardless of type and scale, larger scale is easier to learn on as spacing is easier to get done.

As for the Longboat and Bounty Ship, most have nearly sold bulkhead frames with sections that are precut to allow for easy breakaway.

Most kits are what are called Plank on bulkhead (POB) as they are made with widely spaced bulkheads, versus a Plank on Frame (POF) which has many more closely spaced frames, almost or exactly what real ship had.

Two suggestions to help with your thinking:

1. Use search tool here to check out what others have posted in build logs about the kit and ship.
2. Go to venders website, and look for instructions, many like Model Shipways/Model Expo you can download instructions for review before buying kit to see exactly what your getting into.

Another thing to think of is do you want your first kit to be single planked hull, which is only one layer, where you see it in all it glory, or gore, depending on job done, or a double planked hull, where you do a heavy first layer, which can be ugly and then fixed with sanding and putty, and it gets a second thin layer added for final hull finish which is easier due to first layer holding structure and smoothness.

Good luck with what ever you choose.

 

[bluenos2]

Hello new guy. I have some advice from someone who has been building for 65 years. Be very cautious as to your first build. Running out and buying that sailing ship with multiple masts and massive rigging may bring your enthusiasm to an abrupt halt. A better introduction would be the first wooden model I built, the Bluenose or any other schooner. A long boat is another good example. It will teach you basics of the build. The Bluenose doesn't have a lot of rigging and few on deck features. Then you can progress to a more complicated build. Purchase some books on planking and rigging. These will serve you well as you hopefully progress in this hobby. As to tools. You don't need a Dremel or any other rotary tools to start. Files, sanding tools and some basic wood working tools, that's all you require at first. Pva wood glue and CA adhesives will become standard. Good luck may the Force be with you.

 

[regex]

A better introduction would be the first wooden model I built, the Bluenose or any other schooner

Yeah, I picked the above choices based on the rigging, believe it or not. I eventually ordered the 1/48 Longboat from Model Shipways for the first build rather than the larger 1/24 Armed Longboat. Good thing for me based on your comment here, my biggest maritime interest is two-mast West Coast US schooners. Depending on how the longboat build goes I'll be looking into a Bluenose or similar ship next. Thanks for the advice!

 

[DARIVS ARCHITECTVS]

Hi, new guy here, wanted to ask for advice on picking out my first kit. What I'm most interested in the long-run would be historically accurate models that I can pile a bunch of fun details onto. For background, I have experience with plastic models, modifying pewter miniatures for wargames, building terrain, and general carpentry skills, and already have most of the tools I need. I think I'll need to secure some glue, clips, clamps, rubber-bands, one of those big cylinder tips for my soldering iron, and maybe a couple new files. No big deal there, that's a relatively minor set of purchases and I won't regret any of them in the long run. I do not have a rotary tool like a Dremel or Proxxon (possible future purchase) but I do have several cordless drills which might do in a pinch.

Anyway, I'm interested in the following models for my first kit:

OcCre San Juan - I do not really like the Polaris and have seen some discussion surrounding whether it's actually a "schooner" by hull. The San Juan appears to be a good alternative from the same company and looks like an interesting kit. My big issue here is scale, it's 1/70 (why not 1/72?) and I'm worried about the rigging being a pain in the rear for a first-time build.

OcCre Bounty Boat - I like this guy, it has good detail and the scale is a decent size. Biggest worry is possible planking on frame.

Model Shipways Armed Longboat - This looks like a fun kit but it is explicitly plank on frame (I guess the Bounty Boat is too). My worry here is that, from the build logs I've seen of other Model Shipways Longboats, the "frame" pieces look to start as "bulkheads" which must be cut down and I don't know if I have the tools to do that inside cutting in a precise manner.

Big question here is which one would probably be the best to start with or which one(s) would be best to avoid for the first kit? I'd be happy with any of them and will probably end up building at least two of them.

Hoping to eventually work my way up to that beautiful Mamoli Catalina but the planking absolutely looks like it requires solid experience, so that's a long-term goal. First things first.

Thanks in advance! There's so much on this site to be inspired by and I hope I can eventually contribute in even a small way.

First thing: Get a model that appeals to you. Why? Because building a model ship takes an incredible amount of patience and deication because of how long it takes to build a nice one. If you don't choose one that inspires you, you will lose interest and never finish it. Many beginners end up doing this.

Second thing: Choose a plank-on-bulkhead (POB) hull is double-planked. It has a first layer followed by a final layer of planking. You can screw up all you want on the first layer while you learn to plank, because it won't show anyway. Also, and you can splice in repair planks, use filler to fill depressions and gaps, and get lots of practice in order to get ready for the FINAL layer, which is made from nice hardwood veneer strips and will look fine if you carefully shaped and sanded the hull before applying them. It's the final layer where you cut the planks to specific lengths and shape and fit them carefully to the hull in the correct pattern. You can do it, especially if you have the patience and care to paint tiny miniatures.

If you are a bit scared of planking, you're not the first, BUT if you look at some tutorial videos, get advice from members here, get a pamphlet or PDF on planking, you CAN do it, and do it well even on your first try. A large hull is EASIER to plank than a tiny one so build a model that has sime size to it. Artesania Latina's San Francisco II is a great starter ship if you like Spanish galleons, and you really want some cannons on the model.


Third thing: You can add LOTS of details by making them from bits of wood that you shape, or using a mechanical pencil to draw trenails on the deck planks, or add miniature figures of sailor to add life to your model. You can also cut your own sails from cloth and add sails along with the running rigging lines used to control them after some research book reading. We can suggest rigging books based on what type of ship you choose to build.

Fourth thing: when choosing the complexity of your first model, take into account your level of experience using hand tools. If you have some experience carving wood, building detailed plastic or other models, experience with miniature painting, access and experience with a band saw, mill, lathe, or even a Dremel, you may be able to choose a moderately detailed model as your firts ship and not a basic one. There are few guys who have honed their tool and craft skills prior to taking on their first model. Myself and DocKattner are in that category, and we went right to the top and built multiple gundeck men of war with handmade sails for our first builds. You have to judge your capability and choose accordingly. The key is, you must have TONS of patience. The rest will follow.

Fifth thing: The fastest way to learn is to read build logs on this forum. Use the search engine to hunt down logs of ships you have interest in. Logs contain jillions of ideas and tips. They show you what research books to purchase for your style of vessel, and you will need a few since they accelerate your knowledge in ship design and modeling. Best of all, the build logs are FREE.

Sixth thing: Buy a Dremel. Alongside various shapped sanding blocks and sanding sticks, it is super useful. You can get away with a battery powered one, which is useful in tight spaces, but for cutting, the cord powered one is king. I also highly recommend a desktop sized band saw. It cuts SO much smoother than a scroll saw, and you can cut planking stripsfrom veneer, small model parts, and all sorts of things. It is essetial if you are scratch building a model and want to make your parts quickly and efficiently. Buy X-Acto or other brand of razor knives and LOTS of spare blades, because wood dulls them. I have a fine oilstone for re-honing the edge of razor knifeblades to save a small bit of money when they get dull.

 

[bluenos2]

You already have good skills out of the shoot. You'll purchase more tools as you progress. The first book I purchased when I got into this business is Ship Modeling Simplified by Frank Mastini. ISBN 0071558675. Out of print but may still be available online as used. I highly recommend it. What ever craft you choose to build do as much research as possible, this will help you immensely. You may hit the wall at some point. Put the kit away and step back for a while. As you have like me a background in plastic pull out that Revell 1/32 snap tite kit and go zen. Then when you're ready get back to it. The basics aren't that bad, final planking can be a bitch. But you'll learn with help here. Rigging is another mother. There are books out there for this subject. The googler is a good source. This is a great hobby as it preserves the history of the ages of sail and all things watery. After your build you'll step back and say man I did this. Good on you.

 

[AllanKP69]

What I'm most interested in the long-run would be historically accurate models

If historically accurate models are your goal, along with the kits you choose, a modest set if good books will help you. In addition, you can find a wealth of information for free on various websites such as the RMG Collections site. There are contemporary drawings, contracts and lists of scantlings available for many vessels. In choosing a project, it is sometimes good to see what contemporary information is available for the boats or ships you are considering then go with the one with the most information.

Good luck Rege

Allan

 

[Rob444]

As one who was doing plastic models for at least 15 years, my advice is to start simple. Make mistakes on a less expensive boat before you plunge into something you really want to shine. Model expo makes a dory as part of a 3 ship shipwright series that is fun to build, comes with great instructions and is a good way to get used to the very different "feel" of wooden boats over plastic models. I believe the long boat is the best bet if you want to choose amongst your choices.

I second the idea to buy "Ship Modeling Simplified" by Frank Mastini. Good book. That being said there is a gold mine of information here. Also you tube has multiple videos on almost anything you will do for model ship building.

You can produce your own sanding sticks or get wonderful ones at a place that sells products to file nails. You never have enough clamps but you can modify clothes pins and binder clips to help you.





I have a Dremel and it certainly has many uses. However, the go to rotary I use now is actually a $13 nail drill with a sanding drum and arrowmax drill bits which is so light weight and easy to use, especially around delicate parts. You can find these in Amazon. It certainly does not have the accessories such as cut off wheels that the Dremel has but it is so compact I just leave it out and use it about 90% of the time I would use a Dremel.


That being said, I think your most valuable resource are all the wonderful people here who are more than willing to help out!

Rob

 

[swampdweller126]

Hello and welcome to the forum