ship chandlers

[Dave Stevens (Lumberyard)]

exactly what is a ship chandlers and how far back do the go in history? i know in modern times they supply ships with supplies but way back did they supply rope, fittings, tools and everything to build a ship? or did each shipyard produce their own fittings. Kind of like marine architects i do not think they start from scratch when designing a ship or ship fittings i would think it is more a process of improving what exist before. I understand in kit manufacturing it is cost effective to use the same fittings in different kits over and over. But in real life were fittings designed as one off? Same with ships being in a certain "Class" are these all sister ships or when a major change is made the "class" changes?
From the start were ship designers broken down into specializes like a foot doctor, nose and throat doctor etc? an architect only focuses on hull shape or fittings or hull plating.
i think it would be helpful for model builders to get a basic understanding of what they are modeling and why things are done a certain way

 

[AllanKP69]

I am guessing these are rhetorical questions with the idea someone else will post answers. Then again, maybe not....... No matter, great way to bring out information Dave.
Class.... I am guessing it's based on an original design that was passed to His Majesty's yards as well as numerous yards. For example The Arrogant-class 74-gun ship was a 12-ship class of 3rd-rate ships of the line designed for the Royal Navy by Sir Thomas Slade. There are drawings available and even better, one or two contracts with all the scantlings for anyone wanting to build one of the ships within the class.
Allan

 

[Dave Stevens (Lumberyard)]

what brought up this is the bilge pumps for the Hawke i am finding different "styles" so which one is right or are they all correct?

 

[DAWarden-(Jaager)]

The RN - in the last half of the 18thC. would reactivate an old design. This happening after a supposedly "improved" class had joined the fleet and had been tested. For the 18thC. RN - a mostly unsaid theme that seems to pervade Rif Winfield is that the master shipwrights at the various navy yards had a cut throat and acrimonious relationship. They seem to have celebrated a failure by a competitor. They also seem to have had a less than cooperative relationship with the central board in London. This probably had an effect on any uniformity between sisters that we would wish for.

The Niagara was maybe supervised by an actual shipwright but built by soldiers? Using local green timber. In a location considered as wilderness. It is not a duty that I think would appeal to an established and experienced shipwright. I doubt that building to east coast navy spec was much of a priority. It was probably - whatever works. It was more a suicide mission in an acute emergency than anything regular Navy - wasn't it actually Army anyway? I probably could not find a subject less suited to meet any expected uniformity for its time.

 

[Jerome]

Chandlers of a hundred years ago would have supplied rope, line and miscellaneous hardware like lamps, lamp oil, wicks for the lamps, plates, cutlery, galley utensils, possibly blocks and such.
Usually the smaller ship items.
Bollards, winches, heavy stuff would have been made in the yard by the blacksmith shop.
In the ship yard itself there would have been rotating crews that did specified work, like framing, planking, chaulking, rigging and finish work.
These crews would travel around as needed by individual yards building ships.

 

[AllanKP69]

so which one is right or are they all correct

As you know, there are very few absolutes in building ships in the age of sail. Which Hawke are you speaking about? I think there were seven of them.
Allan

 

[Kurt Konrath]

I would think that changes to things like bilge pumps or Elm Tree pumps would come as someone developed a new process to save time or material.

I would think that common wood things would be copied and reused as wood was not an issue in those days.

Changes due to material shortage or cost may come to effect yard use and designs, as well as efficiency.

I would assume major shipyards had what we call at work a "back-shop" that builds or assembles common items like blocks, cleats, cannons and carriages that are needed when the ship is ready. This might include chairs, tables, bunks and tools for gun crews.

This would free up the actual shipwrights to work on the ships hull.

Another thing I would think is done by ship chandlers would be build up of masts and yards off ship so they can be installed when ready to save time, much like many model builders do today.