• SUBSCRIBE TO SHIPS IN SCALE TODAY!

    The beloved Ships in Scale Magazine is back and charting a new course for 2026!
    Discover new skills, new techniques, and new inspirations in every issue.

    NOTE THAT OUR NEXT ISSUE WILL BE MARCH/APRIL 2026
  • Win a Free Custom Engraved Brass Coin!!!
    As a way to introduce our brass coins to the community, we will raffle off a free coin during the month of August. Follow link ABOVE for instructions for entering.

Sovereign of the Seas - Mantua by Brian

Bri62 said:
Yes John I have already elongated the hole not sure how far stbd it has to go 4-5 mm?
Click to expand...
Not sure how to advise --since I "bashed" the bowsprit, Sergal kit bits not to my liking - but note that mast upwards angle became an issue later in my build - it was too low and figurehead did not have proper spacing - Also I did recenter the mast angle forward - Mckay does not as you saw in his image ...

Glad that my log might prove to be of some occasional help -

Regards,
 
Bri62 said:
Yes John I have already elongated the hole not sure how far stbd it has to go 4-5 mm?
Click to expand...
The center line of the bowsprit was offset from the centerline of the keel to starboard 18 inches (5.6mm at 1:78). This was from an AI search so their information may be from an unreliable source. Buying into this information is up to you, so caveat emptor. From John's post it sounds like McKay addresses this in part. There is the model at RMG. If it is accurate, I am sure you can enquire about this from their staff. They are usually pretty good at getting back with the information although summer holidays may drag it out.

This is of no help, but maybe interesting. The angles on the contemporary drawing and the model at RMG are really close. The date of the drawing is unknown and the model is from 1830 so one or both could be how she looked when she was refitted and renamed Royal Sovereign in 1660 or they may just be wrong.
Allan
1782145214174.jpeg
 
Last edited:
I will follow your build with great interest. At the risk of being negative, I think I should say one thing before you get too far. Please take McKay's book with a grain of salt. There are a number of errors in it, many of which are egregious. For example, and contrary to what McKay says, the Sovereign did not have a square tuck stern, and it did not have falls in its gun decks. The latter problem cascades. It means the positions of the gun ports and wales shown by McKay are incorrect. Also, the shape of his hull isn't right. He used the wrong dimensions for the midship bend. Like you, I bought the book. It was a mistake.

At any rate, I am very interested in what you will do with this model.
 
How does this look for angle and position? nothing finalised yet so able to change it.

IMG20260622183532.jpgIMG20260622183544.jpg

It will move more to the stbd if needed. according to info on the net it only has to clear the foremast!!
 
Last edited:
I'm too lazy to measure the angle on your picture, but a commonly used angle is 24 degrees. This is also where RC Anderson puts it in his book on Rigging in the Days of the Spritsail Topmast. I wouldn't make the angle smaller than this, but some models have it as high as 44 degrees.
 
One thing I forgot to add was the distance. The reason the bowsprit was offset in these early ships is because the foremast was set so far forward. The bowsprit was offset to keep it from bumping into that mast. So, as long as your bowsprit clears the foremast, you should be OK.
 
Charlie, I went back to your build log which I love. I clicked on the link for the book review at Amazon. Interesting how even the experts can disagree on such basic things
Allan
 
Last edited:
Thank you VERY much, Allan.
There is a lot that's not known about this ship, so there will naturally be some disagreements. Put 10 experts on this ship in a room, and you'll get 11 opinions.
 
PS: I did not want to post images from my log. I don't like to step into other member's work that way.
That second image is from somewhere at google images FYI

PS2: note that figurehead is also too close to mast Hmmmm - the issue that I had as well
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top