ZEEHAEN 1639, 1:37.5, Dutch fluit from Dutch Explorer Abel J. Tasman by Marcus

[flying_dutchman2]

Installed more wales on the hull. There are 5 wales on each side.

Three wales equally spaced.

2 wales equally spaced.

Stern

Bow (bit crooked, final planking will adjust).

Wales:
There will be 3 strips of 2mm thick glued on top of each other. Each wale will be 6mm thick and the wood is walnut.

The rest of the ship:
1st planking layer is basswood and second layer is cherry. What I like about cherry is that it darkens over time.

Last month at the woodworkers club meeting I was given lots of walnut and cherry planks so that is the wood to be uses for planking. Furthermore, someone gave me a slab of basswood (12"x 12" x 2"). This wood I will use for the carvings.

Marcus

 

[flying_dutchman2]

On both sides of the Fluit the lower 3 wales have been glued on. The 1st upper wale is pinned to the hull and drying. Towards the stern this plank has to be bend in two different directions.


Lots of pins used, a "PIN FOREST"


Stern.

After the 3 lower wales with enough space between them for the 1st layer of planking, I should have done this differently.

After the 1st lower wale, I should have installed a strip of basswood next to it and then a strip of walnut, etc. Instead, I made little blocks and pinned those between the wales.
Complete Waste of Time!! Oh Well.......

Started planking the 1st layer with basswood started with strips next to the keel. I was going to follow the planking pattern from the Fluit pictures in the book but they are all different so I will follow the pattern from the Boyer which is similar to Fluit planking.


More planking of the 1st layer. Planking the area between the stern and where the poop deck is to be placed is a challenge. Basswood soaked for 4 days to get it thoroughly wet, then slowly bending it 2 ways and pinning it down with pushpin. Lots of pins used.

It is a tedious process.



Marcus

 

[flying_dutchman2]

Here is some more planking , the walnut shows where the wales are going to be.

Getting a bit boring?
There is progress......


Bow

Stern

More planking. This time, besides push pins there are clamps as well. Building up the back of the ship.



She is looking good, nice curved hips .
Not a straight line anywhere in the first layer of planking

Marcus

 

[flying_dutchman2]

I am going to try to explain this and if you don't understand, please feel free to ask questions.

I wanted to plank the Fluit in similar ways as the models in the 17th century Dutch merchant ships book, pages 73 to 77 (look below, pictures from the book and the model).

The wales were installed first and I followed the contours of the ship without a problem.



Then started planking going up and down from the wales and there I got into trouble. Also planked few strokes away from the keel.

The models in the book show the following: the plank is at its lowest around the middle of the ship.
It then slightly curves up towards the bow and the plank butt, ends up straight at the stem post.


From the bottom wale going up, planking is easy to execute, lots of curves but nothing extreme.

From the bottom wale going down, every planking strip becomes difficult to execute. Not only curved like a 'smile', but the plank is also curved inward (when you hold a plank by its sides with your thumb and pointing finger and putting pressure on the fingers to bowe the plank lengthwise).

All plank butts, end up on an angle against both stern post and stem post on the model.
This is not like the models in the book.



Bow


Stern

In the book the stern area is much more bowed then my model. The models in the book have fat hips, whereas my model has skinny hips. It still curves. (I'll figure this out when I built my next sectional Fluit, just the bow and the stern).


Fat hips


Skinny hips


Fat hips

Furthermore, when I cut out the stern bulkhead #5, #10, #15 and #20 and spaced them 38mm of each other it was what the plans looked like.
Looking at the models in the book bulkhead #0 (if there is such a thing) is the same width as bulkhead #5.

Conclusion
I read on other forums that planking a Fluit was a difficult exercise. (maybe I should have built a Cat first, which is similar to a Fluit).
I cut out the bulkheads correctly and lined them up with spaces correctly.
I am just not getting the fat hips.
*********
I could start all over......... not doing that.

I could saw (cut off) her where bulkhead #30 is and recreate the ship from bulkhead 5 to 30 with bigger hips.

Leave the ship as is and install the second layer of planking like what the book shows.
See if it is possible to built up both the bow and stern to get the results (bigger hips) of what is in the book.

If you got this far, thank you for reading.

Marcus

 

[flying_dutchman2]

Finished the first layer of planking.




Next I will measure the skinny hip area and see how much to build it up. I will create a stern piece of 5 bulkheads (#5 thru 25) and use that to build it up, so if there are mistakes I can easily undo it and I will not wreck the model if I did it on that.

After thoroughly studying the lines plan and making templates in every combination, taking the templates and lining them up where they are supposed to be, I've come to the conclusion that everything checks out.







Just to make sure I checked every book, article and research paper that have pictures of Fluits and came to the conclusion that the models in the Merchant book are very different than some of the articles 'and' the Abel Tasman book.


The above picture shows that the hips are smaller than the Merchant book, but looks like my model.



Abel Tasman book


My model is similar to the Abel Tasman model. The hips on both models are smaller than the Merchant book models.


What did I learn from this?
Bofore freaking out. . , check out all your sources. Ships evolved throughout the years. I don't have enough information on the topic, but I know the fluit changed in hip size and length over the years.

There was a type of Fluit for every country and every type of industry the Dutch traded with. I wrote something about that in the 1st or 2nd post.

Next, I need to hollow more out of the inside of the hull so the decks fit.
Sand the outside smooth.

Marcus

 

[flying_dutchman2]

Up to this point everything seems OK. Then Ab Hoving gave me some advice. Ab has built several Fluits, as well as the Zeehaen.


Hello Marcus,
I want to make a few remarks about your planking. Sorry I didn't keep up with this thread but seeing your planking only now you deserve some clues because of your impressive drive to build this difficult model.

The first thing you should let go is thinking that a ship can be planked with straight strips from fore to aft. It is a wide-spread misunderstanding caused by kit makers that straight strips can plank a round model. In reality there is not a single straight plank in a ship's outside planking. Take wider strips and shape them according to the shape of the ship: they look like crooked sabres. Never force the wood, treat it gently and it will do what you want without splitting or breaking. Twisting wood in different directions for instance is a proces that can only be done by applying heat, and only after you have made sure that the piece of plank you are applying really fits its destination. You show my Zeehaen model from the pictures in the book, but if you really study those pictures, you should see that every strake of planking consists of at least three separate pieces of wood and mostly more. Bending wood with heat (for instance a flame of a candle) is a technique you can master if you apply pressure to the hot wood and feeling that it gives way at a certain moment. That's how you get the shape. If you can mount the plank without using force, that's when you are on the right track.


Secondly the mounting of the wales is, like you said yourself, crucial. If they are in the right location and have the right curve, very little can go wrong. Now look at your side view and ask yourself: is the curve of my whale flawless? I don't think you can say yes. You gave it a lot of attention, but you missed it slightly. A solution could be another technique: dress the unplanked hull with a wide strip of paper and draw the lines of the wales on it until you finally feel you have the shape right. Don't decide at once. Try to find a satisfying shape and put the model away for a few days. Then look at it again and repeat the proces. If you are satisfied with the run, take off the paper and cut the wales. You will see how curved the shape is. It also helps measuring if you draw a waterline on the unplanked hull for reference.

It diminishes the problem of orientation and gives you a landmark to work from.
This is really challenging stuff. I can honestly tell you that I'm wrestling with the shape of the hips of fluits up to today, even though I built quite a few. Recently I was trying my hand on a 'wadconvooier', a small armed admiralty vessel, used to protect merchants on the 'Zuiderzee'. It is not a ship type, but rather a function, for which several types were used. One of them really looks like a fluit, but shows another type of rig. I thought I could use old plans for another fluit I made by rescaling the draught. I was wrong. The result was another candidate for the dustbin where it is now, because the hips were placed too low:




Finding the right curves is the most challenging part of the proces. And there is only one way to learn: the hard way.
Edited December 21, 2019 by Ab Hoving

 

[flying_dutchman2]

Ab,
I did force the planks at the bow area.




I was trying to copy the planking of the models in the Merchant book. I usually don't do this. While planking my Utrecht and Boyer, no plank was forced.

You are correct about the three bottom installed wales. There is a slight curve from the stern to about the middle of the ship, then they are straight, going slightly up and ending in abrupt corners of the bow. I measured several times to where they were supposed to be and drew the lines on the bulkheads. I will definitely change this in the second planking and get a better curve towards the middle of the ship.


One can see from the area near the keel that the planks are not one piece. That is not possible.


Marcus

 

[flying_dutchman2]

Glad you take it this way Marcus.
I didn't realize you planned a double planking. In that case I would do my best to sand the first planking up to a degree that nothing is left of the irregularities you caused by rather random planking. I would even go as far as using filler to get a smooth and even surface to lay the outer planking on.
You might consider a layer of white paint so you can draw the lines of the planking directly on the hull.
I don't know how you want to attach that planking. Just glue?
It may be a bit late for an advice, but I think the use of balsa wood for spacers between frames is rather useless. I don't consider balsa wood as wood. You cannot use nails or dowels in that stuff. Any kind of wood would have been better, as it would have given you the opportunity to choose the locations of nails or dowels. Now you can only use your plywood frames. Plywood is useless in modelbuilding too. Another fairytale from the kit business.
Where you stand now, you might just as well have built a solid hull, carving it into the right shape. Or you will have to give real building a try: Start with keel and posts and build your frames and planking like in the real thing. Have you read Harold Underhill's Plank-on-frame Models? I can recommend it.
Ab

 

[Jimsky]

Hello, Marcus. I would like to invite Ab Hoving and join our SOS family, so he can communicate and answer all questions directly in your building log. I think that would be awesome!

 

[Heinrich]

Hi Marcus.

For followers and lovers of Dutch ships such as I am, this is an absolute fascinating build - in fact the input of Ab Hoving is mind-blowing to say the least. His sentence : "give real building a try: Start with keel and posts and build your frames and planking like in the real thing" is an eye-opener. It may be uncomforting to some, but the absolute truth. @flying_dutchman2: As the builder of a Fluyt, Marcus you are walking an untrodden path and should be commended for your bravery. You have already gained a wealth of information compared to someone who has yet to start an endeavour of this kind.

I think, @Jimsky 's suggestion to ask Ab to join this forum is a wonderful one. Now ... an Ab Hoving-tutored POF build of a 17th Century Dutch ship: that is a prospect to drool over!

Kind regards - Heinrich

 

[donfarr]

I agree guys it sure is, THAT WOULD BE WONDERFUL. Don

 

[flying_dutchman2]

I will pm Ab on modelshipworld.
Marcus

 

[flying_dutchman2]

Hi Marcus.
As the builder of a Fluyt, Marcus you are walking an untrodden path and should be commended for your bravery. You have already gained a wealth of information compared to someone who has yet to start an endeavour of this kind.

Kind regards - Heinrich

Hi Heinrich,
Thank you for the compliment
90% of my builds are 17th century Dutch ships, preferably merchant ships and the United Provinciën in the 17th century had all kinds in those days, they still do. The other 10% is a non Dutch ship here and there. Like a Catboat for my sister.

The Fluit is a challenge and it is a lot of fun building her. Getting the advice from Ab on modelshipworld has eased a lot of my frustrations with building the Zeehaen. The few books I have on the subject and the many PhD dissertations in pdf form from the NET have helped me great deal.
Marcus

 

[flying_dutchman2]

Took drastic measures and removed the planking between bulkhead 5 and 10.



Redid the planking so they would extend way over the rudder.

Combination of wood glue and sawdust was used to fill in the gaps. Most of this will be sanded away.


Both sides are done and drying overnight.



I have been having a lot of trouble with the stern. When you look at the Fluit from the top and side there is nothing wrong. But when you look from where the tiller goes into the ship, there is a whole lot of wrong


The ship overall has all the curves the way the plans show me and it all looks pleasing to the eye. Nothing is abrupt. The bottom 3 wales are placed correctly and the upper 2 need to be higher in the stern area than they are now. This will be done with the second layer of planking.
BUT (here it comes)
When I planked the bulkheads towards the stern, it didn't end up in a point above the rudder - see below-, that is the area that makes the boat look way off.


Top view. Tiller rests on the rudder post and you can see I am way off, by 12mm.

Have to figure out how I can move it all towards the middle.
I don't want to trash the model and start all over again or remove the planking from bulkheads 30 to 5.

One area where the tiller goes into the ship there is a 90 degree curve opening. It is bigger than the plans and what the pictures of Fluits in books show.

All in all the further I get into this build the more I think that I should have build the 'cat' first as it looks somewhat like a fluit. Setting that thought aside....... I will continue with this build.

Marcus

 

[flying_dutchman2]

Hi Marcus,

Drastic, indeed.
First: do you have a symmetry problem? Maybe it's the picture, but it looks like one side is closer to the middle than the other.
Now your problem: you are making the hole for the helm much too big. Your planking ends way too early. You have to stretch the end of the planking as far as you can. Maybe things get clearer with a view on the unplanked stern of the fluit:



This 3D representation was made with the help of my great 'partner in crime', Rene Hendrickx.
As you can see the tops of the frame parts rise above the highest wale, so your planking should continue there as well. That will close the gap for a big part. Then you will end up with something like this:


I hope this helps.
Ab

Edited December 20, 2019 by Ab Hoving

 

[flying_dutchman2]

The Rijksdienst voor Cultureel Erfgoed (Governmental Service for Cultural Inheritance) is almost finished with the preparations for bringing the 3D construction of Witsen's pinas online and there are plans to do the same with the fluit. There are still some barriers to overcome, but work, executed by a small firm called Tijdlab, is progressing fast and we hope to present the first online version in spring.
I started pushing the project of the 3D presentation of the pinas (which is the only Dutch seventeenth century vessel we have all the data of) in 2006, but actually the reconstruction of the ship after contemporary data goes back to 1980, when I laid my hands on Witsen's book for the first time. The plans can be found here: https://nautarch.tamu.edu/shiplab/AbHoving.htm. The 3D work started in 2013, after the first initiatives stranded because of the financial crisis in 2008. I have good hope that we will be online early 2020.
So be patient.
Here an image of a walk on deck of the pinas:


Ab Hoving

 

[flying_dutchman2]

Remember Marcus: many people ran into the same problems with - as you do here. It is a very tricky shape to make. Many gave up. To tell you the truth, I discarded a small fluit-like model myself a month ago. (Edit: I just discovered that I told this story earlier. Sorry for that. It's the age, you know ) I was trying my hand at a rather unknown type of ship, a 'wadconvooier', a small armed vessel to convoy merchants on the Zuiderzee between Amsterdam and the inlets between the islands up north the country. All I have as a source are some contemporary pictures, showing different vessels with the same function. On some pictures the type looks like a Statenjacht with an additional mizzen mast, on others it resounds the shape of a fluit. Nevertheless I (also) tried my hand at the fluit-like type and tried to get the widest point of the hull at the hight of the upper wale. I seriously failed because I used a design for another fluit, which was incorrect in this context. The model disappeared into the dustbin and I started anew.


This is the Statenjacht-like type of the wadconvooier.


To the left another 'watte convoyer' of unsure type. Probably fluit-like.


Here an obvious fluit-like type. Mind the widest point at the second wale, where the man in the boat points at, as if he wants to warn me....


And here my first try, with a shape I did not like. As you can see the widest point is way too low. So it ended in the dustbin.


And here the second try. The shape of the 'hips' comes closer to the one on the painting, but I'm still not completely convinced. This one might end up in the dustbin too...

All I want to say Marcus, is that there is nothing to be ashamed of if you remove parts of your model, or even if you start all over again. Because remember, a mistake made in the beginning of the building process is like a pregnancy: it will only get more and more visible.

Now you still have the chance to improve your build. Take it.
Ab
Edited December 21, 2019 by Ab Hoving

 

[flying_dutchman2]

Ab,
I am never ashamed of redoing a model. With building the Utrecht, I got it right after the third try. I was continually having problems with the stern. Seems that is where I always have a problem with. Same with the Boyer.
I also appreciate your constructive criticism and you show this with pictures.
I think it is safe to say that you are the only modeler on MSW that has built several Fluits and I am in the process of building one. So I rely on you, Jan and a few other Dutch people to give me advice.
Marcus

 

[flying_dutchman2]

That's the spirit Marcus, when the going gets tough, the tough get going.
Ab

 

[flying_dutchman2]

A question to Ab
This plan is included in the book "Risse von schiffen des 16. und 17 jahrhunderts"
If I look at the plans of Golden Hind that are also included, they don't look really reliable.
Am I right?


Patrick