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HMS SotS Gun Carriages ?

DARIVS ARCHITECTVS

DARIVS ARCHITECTVS

Joined
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Can anyone tell me why DeAgostini would use gun carriages more suited for land based artillery than the four wheels trucks used as naval gun carriages on the upper forecastle and decks high up on the stern, the ones aimed at the waist, presumably for blasting boarders? Are these things balanced well enough to allow a crew to operate them without train tackles at the rear of each carriage? Basically, should I dispose of the DeAgostini carriages in favor of naval gun trucks?

These things just don't look right...

Deck Cannon.jpgDeck Cannon2.jpg
 
Hi Kurt
Yes potentially or you could cut the "tail" off and see how they work out.They may be too short though and also look "muzzle heavy".Amati's "decorative" cannons are available in different sizes and should match up with the dummy barrels pretty well.

Kind Regards

Nigel
 
Hallo Kurt,
according Three Decks the Sovereign o t Seas had this armament
ww.JPG

British First Rate ship of the line 'Sovereign of the Seas' (1637)

British First Rate ship of the line 'Sovereign of the Seas' (1637). Dates of service, name changes, previous and next incarnations, dimensions, armament, commanders, officers and crewmen, actions, battles, sources
threedecks.org

So they used on the Forecastle etc. only Culverins, and I am pretty sure very small ones.
The shown barrel is one older one, which is very similar to a swivel gun, so it could be, that they had carriages with only one axis. They were relatively easy to move, due to the fact, that these guns were not very heavy, and also had not so big repulsion. So I think it is worth to search a little bit more about these carriages.

Nevertheless John McKay is showing them with four wheels. Take a look at Nigels Book Review

Book review - Sovereign of the Seas 1637-John McKay

Sovereign of the Seas by John McKay 1637 Part 1 Hardcover:296 Pages Publisher:Seaforth Publishing 3rd March 2020 Language:English ISBN-10:1526766299 ISBN-13:978-1526766299 DIMENSIONS:254x295x25mm RRP:£40 SYNOPSIS Sovereign of the Seas was probably the most lavishly decorated warship ever...
shipsofscale.com

Maybe this book would be good for the research and for the bashing of your kit
 
Uwek said:
Hallo Kurt,
according Three Decks the Sovereign o t Seas had this armament
View attachment 149281

British First Rate ship of the line 'Sovereign of the Seas' (1637)

British First Rate ship of the line 'Sovereign of the Seas' (1637). Dates of service, name changes, previous and next incarnations, dimensions, armament, commanders, officers and crewmen, actions, battles, sources
threedecks.org

So they used on the Forecastle etc. only Culverins, and I am pretty sure very small ones.
The shown barrel is one older one, which is very similar to a swivel gun, so it could be, that they had carriages with only one axis. They were relatively easy to move, due to the fact, that these guns were not very heavy, and also had not so big repulsion. So I think it is worth to search a little bit more about these carriages.

Nevertheless John McKay is showing them with four wheels. Take a look at Nigels Book Review

Book review - Sovereign of the Seas 1637-John McKay

Sovereign of the Seas by John McKay 1637 Part 1 Hardcover:296 Pages Publisher:Seaforth Publishing 3rd March 2020 Language:English ISBN-10:1526766299 ISBN-13:978-1526766299 DIMENSIONS:254x295x25mm RRP:£40 SYNOPSIS Sovereign of the Seas was probably the most lavishly decorated warship ever...
shipsofscale.com

Maybe this book would be good for the research and for the bashing of your kit
Click to expand...
Hallo Uwe,

I have McKay's book. Besides that source and the questionable models in museums made in the past, I have not found any information that points to the carriage type. Doris Obručová made some interesting choices in carriage type. I don't know where she got the idea to use demi-culverin carriages for the guns facing outboard, yet used four wheeled carriages for the guns facing the waist of the ship. See her two pictures below. The culverin in the bottom picture came from the Mary Rose, and has a traditional four wheeled carriage.

20110706135317-124129-full.jpg20110707111856-124247-full.jpgMary Rose Culverin.png
 
DARIVS ARCHITECTVS said:
I found it, Nigel. She indeed did base her carriages on this piece below, depicted in Sephton as you thought.

View attachment 149537
Click to expand...

Thanks Kurt,it is a good few years since I walked this research path,funny the stuff you remember,I still forget my PIN number at the cash machine thoughROTFROTF

Kind Regards

Nigel
 
DARIVS ARCHITECTVS said:
Can anyone tell me why DeAgostini would use gun carriages more suited for land based artillery than the four wheels trucks used as naval gun carriages on the upper forecastle and decks high up on the stern, the ones aimed at the waist, presumably for blasting boarders? Are these things balanced well enough to allow a crew to operate them without train tackles at the rear of each carriage? Basically, should I dispose of the DeAgostini carriages in favor of naval gun trucks?

These things just don't look right...

View attachment 149045View attachment 149046
Click to expand...
Don't you dare put such a disgrace on a model of a magnificent ship!
 
Ahoy!
DARIVS ARCHITECTVS - I can try to make gun carriages and barrels SotS (wood and resin) based on the last book and plans of John McKay.
 
SZKUTNIK said:
Ahoy!
DARIVS ARCHITECTVS - I can try to make gun carriages and barrels SotS (wood and resin) based on the last book and plans of John McKay.
Click to expand...
Ho there Szkutnik!

I have a pile of different sized barrels, mostly Amati ones, already purchased. The trucks will be made from scratch out of walnut. I haven't looked closely at the trucks in McKay yet, but they look similar to ones I made for La Couronne. What I would like to do is find brass etched royal English cannon emblems similar the those in the link below, but with the correct rose emblem for SotS.

English Cannon Barrel Emblem
 
Ahoy!
Brass etched Royal English cannon emblems for SotS????? I will not help you in this matter. I do not know, who is the producer?
I can design and make barrels with the correct rose emblem for model SotS as for model Soleil Royal. But resin not brass.
On a scale 1/48 scale the price per unit is 5 Euros or around 6 dollars. The photo shows barrel in scale 1/72

Soleil Royal - design 3D for resin casting.jpgSR-barrels-05.jpg
 
SZKUTNIK said:
Ahoy!
Brass etched Royal English cannon emblems for SotS????? I will not help you in this matter. I do not know, who is the producer?
I can design and make barrels with the correct rose emblem for model SotS as for model Soleil Royal. But resin not brass.
On a scale 1/48 scale the price per unit is 5 Euros or around 6 dollars. The photo shows barrel in scale 1/72

View attachment 151079View attachment 151082
Click to expand...
Mein Gott! Die sind fantastisch! The gun barrels that were on HMS Sovereign of the Seas probably looked the one below. Can you make them in 1:84 scale? That's pretty small.

Cannon-Browne-04.jpg
 
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