Lovely work at scale, Marc.
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Soleil Royal by Heller - an Extensive Modification and Partial Scratch-Build by Hubac’s Historian
- Thread starter Hubac’s Historian
- Start date
- Watchers 86
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- Tags
- 1689 heller hubac refit soleil royal
Thank you, Paul! I hope you are enjoying your travels!
Johann, in my estimation you stand at the very top of the art and craft of ship modeling. To receive such a compliment from you is very rewarding. Thank you!
Among the many losses at MSW was my connection to modelers and their builds, like your incomparable La Creole.
Just yesterday, I learned that Chuck Passaro and Jim Hatch started a new forum, DryDockModeler. I see a number of friends, there, and am considering creating a profile.
Johann, in my estimation you stand at the very top of the art and craft of ship modeling. To receive such a compliment from you is very rewarding. Thank you!
Among the many losses at MSW was my connection to modelers and their builds, like your incomparable La Creole.
Just yesterday, I learned that Chuck Passaro and Jim Hatch started a new forum, DryDockModeler. I see a number of friends, there, and am considering creating a profile.
Hello everyone! I hope all are well.
If I’m being completely honest, at this point, it is very tempting for me to ultimately display the model as laid up, in ordinary, with only the lower mast sections and tops rigged with stays and shrouds. This project began in 2017, and I would LOVE to do something different, at this point.
The reason I am considering this, at this particular time, is that I have to run lengths of line for the sprit sheets, the fore and main sheets and tacks to their main deck kevels, before I can continue building upwards. If I weren’t doing a full rig, I wouldn’t bother with those lines.
HOWEVER, my original intent with this project remains a grand image in my mind. I still think it will be fun to try and create these wildly billowing/unfurling shapes for the fore and main topsails. And, so, I will proceed as though I am doing a full rig.
In anticipation of my surgery early next year, I figured I would try to make the yards and upper masts, so that I could use that time to attach all of the accompanying blocks. My mobility, for a while, will be severely limited, and I don’t see myself moving the hull around the apartment as I maneuver around on a knee scooter. Finishing spars, attaching blocks, and maybe finishing the Africa carving are much more manageable tasks for the first six weeks of recovery.
My friend, Dan Pariser, has offered me his mini-lathe, but I have yet to rent a car to go pick it up. I had some downtime at work, so I devised a hand-drill driven router lathe to see whether I could rough-in the various spar tapers. Included among the SP monograph is a sail and spar plan in 1:96. I am using this as the basis of my spar dimensions.
I figured I’d start with the largest, the main yard, and work at making better and better smaller spars. Here is the set-up I devised:
I wanted to include the octagonal flats at the center of the yard, which are proportionally 1/8th the length of the spar:
The bottom cutting bit is centered on the turning axis of the lathe. Despite taking as much care as I could manage with one hand guiding the router set-up, and the other powering the drill, I could not really control depth and angle of cut. As the dowel began to thin at the extremes of the spar, a pronounced wobble resulted in the end of this little experiment:
So, next I decided I would take the more traditional approach of bandsawing in two planes, and then using finger planes to micro-bevel into the round:
I had found some nice quarter-sawn cherry laying around, and cherry’s natural color has the added advantage, for this application, of appearing to be coated with some kind of preservative pine-tar. This, IMO, is more realistic than the brightness of maple, for example.
I’ve only gotten so far as profiling in one plane, before I was sent out of the shop for a few days. I will be interested to see how my little finger planes perform after a good tune-up.
So, in addition to that project, I have drilled for the f’ocsle bitts and painted the f’ocsle deck. While I was careful to mask for the galley chimney bases, and the belfry knees, I neglected to mask for the gun carriage mounts. That’s okay, though, I can trace their footings and scrape paint as I did for the bitts:
I’m also making a bunch of eye-bolts for the gun-carriage rigging. Basically, almost everything I need to assemble the f’ocsle deck is ready and waiting.
Separately, I’ve spent some time playing around with Google Gemini. In a separate thread, member Naima was using Gemini to bring Van de Velde drawings to “life.” All he did was ask Gemini to make the images more photo realistic. I decided to try the same with several of my trove of French VdV portraits.
La Royal Therese:
Le Monarque:
Generally, the better detailed the drawing, the less AI makes non-sensical additions and substitutions.
The Dauphin Royal, 1680:
John Ott’s adaptation of La Reyne;
Then, it occurred to me that Gemini could probably improve upon the pixelation of the “Gilded Ghost” photo:
It certainly did!
Interestingly - like the DR portrait above, Gemini included a parenthetical suggestion in the caption that this is the “Royal Lo..”
I think Gemini is correct, in this instance. I think the Gilded Ghost is the Royal Louis. I would still love to find the original portrait, if it still exists, so that I could see the coloration of the ship.
Now thoroughly intrigued by the capability of this tech, I then decided to see whether it could create a fully coherent portrait of the gouache bow and stern portraits:
Within mere seconds, here is what Gemini came up with:
I mean - pretty incredible! Gemini decided on a 5-window transom, and also transposed the QG upper finishing to the stern, which I kind of like, if I’m being honest.
Next, I asked Gemini to incorporate Berain’s gouache stern drawing:
AI is still highly imperfect, and the outputs are entirely dependent upon the quality of inputs, but the capability is, nevertheless, astounding.
Looking at this portrait brought to mind an old colorized photograph of Victory:
The positioning of Soleil Royal’s name on the stern counter seems a direct crib from this photo, as well as the perspective and general bearing of the ship. Notice, also, the similarity of the tops! I have no way of knowing exactly where and what Gemini pulls from, but this is a plausible illustration of how Gemini pulls from a broad range of related media.
Anyway, SR 1689 is forging ahead on her diorama sea. Thank you for stopping by.
All the best,
M
If I’m being completely honest, at this point, it is very tempting for me to ultimately display the model as laid up, in ordinary, with only the lower mast sections and tops rigged with stays and shrouds. This project began in 2017, and I would LOVE to do something different, at this point.
The reason I am considering this, at this particular time, is that I have to run lengths of line for the sprit sheets, the fore and main sheets and tacks to their main deck kevels, before I can continue building upwards. If I weren’t doing a full rig, I wouldn’t bother with those lines.
HOWEVER, my original intent with this project remains a grand image in my mind. I still think it will be fun to try and create these wildly billowing/unfurling shapes for the fore and main topsails. And, so, I will proceed as though I am doing a full rig.
In anticipation of my surgery early next year, I figured I would try to make the yards and upper masts, so that I could use that time to attach all of the accompanying blocks. My mobility, for a while, will be severely limited, and I don’t see myself moving the hull around the apartment as I maneuver around on a knee scooter. Finishing spars, attaching blocks, and maybe finishing the Africa carving are much more manageable tasks for the first six weeks of recovery.
My friend, Dan Pariser, has offered me his mini-lathe, but I have yet to rent a car to go pick it up. I had some downtime at work, so I devised a hand-drill driven router lathe to see whether I could rough-in the various spar tapers. Included among the SP monograph is a sail and spar plan in 1:96. I am using this as the basis of my spar dimensions.
I figured I’d start with the largest, the main yard, and work at making better and better smaller spars. Here is the set-up I devised:
I wanted to include the octagonal flats at the center of the yard, which are proportionally 1/8th the length of the spar:
The bottom cutting bit is centered on the turning axis of the lathe. Despite taking as much care as I could manage with one hand guiding the router set-up, and the other powering the drill, I could not really control depth and angle of cut. As the dowel began to thin at the extremes of the spar, a pronounced wobble resulted in the end of this little experiment:
So, next I decided I would take the more traditional approach of bandsawing in two planes, and then using finger planes to micro-bevel into the round:
I had found some nice quarter-sawn cherry laying around, and cherry’s natural color has the added advantage, for this application, of appearing to be coated with some kind of preservative pine-tar. This, IMO, is more realistic than the brightness of maple, for example.
I’ve only gotten so far as profiling in one plane, before I was sent out of the shop for a few days. I will be interested to see how my little finger planes perform after a good tune-up.
So, in addition to that project, I have drilled for the f’ocsle bitts and painted the f’ocsle deck. While I was careful to mask for the galley chimney bases, and the belfry knees, I neglected to mask for the gun carriage mounts. That’s okay, though, I can trace their footings and scrape paint as I did for the bitts:
I’m also making a bunch of eye-bolts for the gun-carriage rigging. Basically, almost everything I need to assemble the f’ocsle deck is ready and waiting.
Separately, I’ve spent some time playing around with Google Gemini. In a separate thread, member Naima was using Gemini to bring Van de Velde drawings to “life.” All he did was ask Gemini to make the images more photo realistic. I decided to try the same with several of my trove of French VdV portraits.
La Royal Therese:
Le Monarque:
Generally, the better detailed the drawing, the less AI makes non-sensical additions and substitutions.
The Dauphin Royal, 1680:
John Ott’s adaptation of La Reyne;
Then, it occurred to me that Gemini could probably improve upon the pixelation of the “Gilded Ghost” photo:
It certainly did!
Interestingly - like the DR portrait above, Gemini included a parenthetical suggestion in the caption that this is the “Royal Lo..”
I think Gemini is correct, in this instance. I think the Gilded Ghost is the Royal Louis. I would still love to find the original portrait, if it still exists, so that I could see the coloration of the ship.
Now thoroughly intrigued by the capability of this tech, I then decided to see whether it could create a fully coherent portrait of the gouache bow and stern portraits:
Within mere seconds, here is what Gemini came up with:
I mean - pretty incredible! Gemini decided on a 5-window transom, and also transposed the QG upper finishing to the stern, which I kind of like, if I’m being honest.
Next, I asked Gemini to incorporate Berain’s gouache stern drawing:
AI is still highly imperfect, and the outputs are entirely dependent upon the quality of inputs, but the capability is, nevertheless, astounding.
Looking at this portrait brought to mind an old colorized photograph of Victory:
The positioning of Soleil Royal’s name on the stern counter seems a direct crib from this photo, as well as the perspective and general bearing of the ship. Notice, also, the similarity of the tops! I have no way of knowing exactly where and what Gemini pulls from, but this is a plausible illustration of how Gemini pulls from a broad range of related media.
Anyway, SR 1689 is forging ahead on her diorama sea. Thank you for stopping by.
All the best,
M
Last edited:
The idea of not owning a car fascinates me to no end. 
I suppose it would until you had to face the fraternal twin tyrannies of either finding street parking, or paying for a garage spot. The cost of a car in NYC is simply a luxury I can not afford.
Hello WojtasS, and thank you for the kind words!
I'm not entirely sure what my next project would be, but I think I would like to do a small, fully framed model from a kit, just to get my feet wet on that side of the hobby. La Belle is, of course, a popular subject.
Alternatively, I'm intrigued by the idea of card modeling. Several people are doing the Provincien, in card, and that would make a lovely hull model. Granted, in 1:96, it is not "small."
The other avenue are the resin printed hulls that can be planked over and built up with interior structure. This has really opened up a variety of interesting new subjects.
I'm not entirely sure what my next project would be, but I think I would like to do a small, fully framed model from a kit, just to get my feet wet on that side of the hobby. La Belle is, of course, a popular subject.
Alternatively, I'm intrigued by the idea of card modeling. Several people are doing the Provincien, in card, and that would make a lovely hull model. Granted, in 1:96, it is not "small."
The other avenue are the resin printed hulls that can be planked over and built up with interior structure. This has really opened up a variety of interesting new subjects.
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La Belle seems like a good place to start. 7P is also a natural consequence, as recreating the Solei Royal of 1669 or the Reyne of 1671 sounds very difficult, if not impossible. So, going with something Dutch that has been well documented is an interesting alternative. The 7P in Seahorse's 1/96 is 65 cm long only slightly shorter than the Heller SR. Whatever you choose, I'm sure you'll handle it
Yeah, I really like that Seahorse model. I think I could do good things with that kit.
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Good treatment with veneer would make much difference
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...
Thank you, Naima! Yes, that little Gemini trick you showed us is astounding! In just a few short years, it will be so much better. In fact, every couple of years, I'll try and remember to do a current de-pixelation photo of the Gilded Ghost picture, just to see what else it can pull from the ether.
Wow. That's about it! 
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You can improve it greatly and make it almoust perfect if you give several source pictures and ask to operate exactly on certain areas or constrains, if you want to go the next level you can also use the Chat Gpt imagegen2 image generation , providing a precise blueprint of what you want and the features you want in , for example if you want a specific shape hull , then add other images for details like sail rigging, or a certain kind of stern or even going into more detailing like what statue to put here or there and so on , you can iterate on that and if you build a precise harness with dos and don't you can pretty much obtain whatever you want. I am not an expert on ships so I just went the easy route by asking Gemini , hey make it realistic, but you can go much deeper than that and more precisely.
Alright, well, I am trying to take advantage of whatever shop time I can sneak-in before surgery in January. The goal is to at least rough-in all of the spars, and maybe even begin making the topmasts. Finishing these spars and equipping them with cleats and blocks and all the various accoutrements is a good recovery project.
So far, I have made the main yard, roughed the fore yard and made blanks for the fore and main topsail yards.
Key to all of this was tuning-up these brass finger planes that I don’t think I paid more than $8, per piece. My expectations for these were low, however, I was delighted to see how nicely machined the plane bodies are, with soles curved across their length and breadth. The plane irons, themselves, have good heft and were nicely ground. I only spent about an hour lapping the plane irons flat on their backs, honing their bevels, and polishing the soles:
I will say, unequivocally, that these micro planes are absolute gems! I don’t know yet, whether the steel is particularly hard, but it hardly matters, as I know that these will sharpen quickly and easily. After stropping, these blades part hair from the back of your hand so deftly that the hair looks like it’s jumping away from the razor’s edge!
These plane irons just as reliably shave their way through the cherry I am using to make the spars. After the failure of my drill/lathe, I am essentially doing the same process that happens in full-scale: profile in two planes; establish center lines; pare at the center from square to octagon, first; repeat along the extremities of the spar; with a shallow depth of cut, I can then shave longitudinal quadrants between center lines; hard rubber profile sanders and 80 grit paper make quick work of fairing the tapers; equalize the octagonal facets at the center of the spar; sand up through the grits to 220.
The process in pictures:
Main yard to the left, fore yard to the right:
The yards will be painted flat black, so I am unconcerned with any of the grain abnormalities of cherry. This also enables me to make all of the yard cleats and brackets from styrene. I will probably coat each yard with tung oil to seal it, until I am actually ready to paint them.
In other news - as I was preparing the f’ocsle and QD gun carriages, I realized that the angle of the barrels was not going to work:
So, in remedy, I padded out the quoins with 3/64” styrene, which I then faceted to reduce the clunkiness of their appearance:
The attitude of the guns, afterward:
Remember, that I have upscaled all of the gun calibers: the guns I am using on these upper decks are really the kit 12-pounders that would ordinarily mount on the main deck. I am pleased with the scale upgrade and am ready to glue-in three eye-bolts per carriage.
And so, it feels good to be making something again. As with all of this stuff, I try to think of each sub-manufacture - spars, in this case - as models unto themselves. The result is that I become excited at the prospect of what all of these things will look like when they are finally ready to go on the model.
I am always more ambitious than I seem to have time for, but I’d like to also have the f’ocsle deck installed with its furniture. I probably won’t get all the gun painting and rigging done before surgery, but that’s okay. I’d really love to get the breast rail installed, along with the chimneys, capstan, bitts, and cathead timbers installed. As it seems they were a regular feature of 17th C. ships of this era - particularly large warships - I will probably also make a fish-davit because it is such a cool piece of equipment that is rarely modeled. Michael D. did a really excellent job of this on his SOS.
As always, thank you for your continued interest and for stopping by.
All the best,
M
So far, I have made the main yard, roughed the fore yard and made blanks for the fore and main topsail yards.
Key to all of this was tuning-up these brass finger planes that I don’t think I paid more than $8, per piece. My expectations for these were low, however, I was delighted to see how nicely machined the plane bodies are, with soles curved across their length and breadth. The plane irons, themselves, have good heft and were nicely ground. I only spent about an hour lapping the plane irons flat on their backs, honing their bevels, and polishing the soles:
I will say, unequivocally, that these micro planes are absolute gems! I don’t know yet, whether the steel is particularly hard, but it hardly matters, as I know that these will sharpen quickly and easily. After stropping, these blades part hair from the back of your hand so deftly that the hair looks like it’s jumping away from the razor’s edge!
These plane irons just as reliably shave their way through the cherry I am using to make the spars. After the failure of my drill/lathe, I am essentially doing the same process that happens in full-scale: profile in two planes; establish center lines; pare at the center from square to octagon, first; repeat along the extremities of the spar; with a shallow depth of cut, I can then shave longitudinal quadrants between center lines; hard rubber profile sanders and 80 grit paper make quick work of fairing the tapers; equalize the octagonal facets at the center of the spar; sand up through the grits to 220.
The process in pictures:
Main yard to the left, fore yard to the right:
The yards will be painted flat black, so I am unconcerned with any of the grain abnormalities of cherry. This also enables me to make all of the yard cleats and brackets from styrene. I will probably coat each yard with tung oil to seal it, until I am actually ready to paint them.
In other news - as I was preparing the f’ocsle and QD gun carriages, I realized that the angle of the barrels was not going to work:
So, in remedy, I padded out the quoins with 3/64” styrene, which I then faceted to reduce the clunkiness of their appearance:
The attitude of the guns, afterward:
Remember, that I have upscaled all of the gun calibers: the guns I am using on these upper decks are really the kit 12-pounders that would ordinarily mount on the main deck. I am pleased with the scale upgrade and am ready to glue-in three eye-bolts per carriage.
And so, it feels good to be making something again. As with all of this stuff, I try to think of each sub-manufacture - spars, in this case - as models unto themselves. The result is that I become excited at the prospect of what all of these things will look like when they are finally ready to go on the model.
I am always more ambitious than I seem to have time for, but I’d like to also have the f’ocsle deck installed with its furniture. I probably won’t get all the gun painting and rigging done before surgery, but that’s okay. I’d really love to get the breast rail installed, along with the chimneys, capstan, bitts, and cathead timbers installed. As it seems they were a regular feature of 17th C. ships of this era - particularly large warships - I will probably also make a fish-davit because it is such a cool piece of equipment that is rarely modeled. Michael D. did a really excellent job of this on his SOS.
As always, thank you for your continued interest and for stopping by.
All the best,
M
Lovely work indeed, Marc. Well played.
Thinking back to WojtasS’s question about what to model next, I remembered this model of a hoy that exists in the NMM colkections:
This is such a lovely little ship. I may be wrong, but doesn’t this exist in kit form from some manufacturer?
This is such a lovely little ship. I may be wrong, but doesn’t this exist in kit form from some manufacturer?
Hayling Hoy 1760 1:48 - PEARWOOD VERSION
Shipping is included in the total price!! Please allow 14 -21 days to fulfill the order!! The product is shipped from China!! Dimensions Scale: 1:48 Length Overall: 675.5mm Height Overall: 653mm Width Overall: 341mm Width of Hull (only): 135mm Length of Hull (only): 488mm) Level: Intermediate...
drydockmodelsandparts.com
Hayling Hoy of 1759 A Fully Framed Building Project by David Antscherl
The Hayling Hoy of 1759 is aimed at the first time scratch builder or for the experienced modeler who is looking for a small project in-between major builds. The framing is based on volume one of the Fully Framed Model ( the Swan series) and this book will be a big help for anyone tackling this...
seawatchbooks.com
Dear Marc,
why not staying with the right side of the channel and building again something Royal, something pure, something French?
ancre.fr
Your progress is great to watch I do
learn a lot from your shown skills.
why not staying with the right side of the channel and building again something Royal, something pure, something French?
The AMARANTE - Corvette: 1744 - Ancre
The present document details the architecture, the fitting-out, the equipment and the rigging of a 12-gun corvette of the years 1745. A monograph including all plans of the timber works 32 plates in 1/36-scale. New: Supplement 28 Boards without sail at 1/24 °. Available in English
ancre.fr
Your progress is great to watch I do
learn a lot from your shown skills.