I've heard of Sunward..... Credit Valley Railway was the place I was told about.
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only connect your external drive when you need it. i presume you are saving your data on the computer besides on the external drive?
Nobody is under any obligation to post here, build logs, or share discussion communications; these are voluntary, and if sharing your work doesn't feel right for you at this point, that's a completely valid choice, and it deserves to be respected. No argument there.
That said, I'll admit I'm a little puzzled. If you'd already concluded there wasn't much here for you, what kept you coming back this past year? Most people stick around because something is working for them, whether that's picking up new ideas, following others' builds, or simply feeling part of something. That’s not unique to SOS.
On the question of 'scorn', I don't think that reflects the general atmosphere here, at least not as most members experience it. Strong opinions exist, sure, they always will in any community worth its salt. But the broad majority of people here are genuinely supportive, whether you're building from a kit or working from scratch. And low participation isn't unique to SOS; on most forums, the majority of members read far more than they post. That's just human nature.
The door is open. It always has been. What you choose to do with that is entirely yours to decide.
Make a backup onto an external disc. Then disconnect it. Store it safely. Perhaps make 2 copies and store one ina different location.
Repeat regularly (weekly? Depends how often you add material)
This is what I do with my digital stuff. You should (!) be bullet proof.
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Well said Jimsky. There is absolutely no bias against kit building on SOS. In fact, the two most viewed build logs are both kit builds! Sure, some builders choose to bash the living daylights out of their kits if they believe they can improve on it. There is no pressure on anyone to do so though. Heck, look at the number of "cheap Halcon" starter kits being built here by modelers who first want to try out the new hobby before investing money in more expensive and complicated kits. Noone scorns those builds - people offer advice and make suggestions, but isn't that what we are here for?
SOS has always embraced new membership and will continue to do so. Personally, I don't care one iota where a member is from and what his past experiences are, As long as we build what we love and love what we build, all is good.
Well said !!!
For what it is worth, I prefer the forum software here on SOS much more than they use(d) on MSW. I find it MUCH easier to navigate the site, favorite and follow threads, find new posts, and search over here on SOS. It is one of the main reasons I come here 90% more than MSW. SOS just offers a much more pleasant browsing experience IMHO.
Hallo zusammen,
Ich habe vor etwa drei Jahren mit diesem Hobby angefangen und sehr viel Spaß damit.
Ebenso konnte ich beide Foren kennenlernen.
Auf beiden wurde von einer Gemeinschaft gesprochen.
Aber ganz ehrlich, was ich hier die letzten Tage zu lesen bekam erschüttert mich.
Ihr seid wie diese Fußballcomunity welche sich Hooligans nennen, geht doch auf die Wiese und haut euch die Fresse ein.
Denn mit gemeinsamem Spaß zu haben, hat dies hier nichts zu tun.
Gehabt euch wohl, mit friedvollen Grüßen aus der Pfalz.
Ich habe vor etwa drei Jahren mit diesem Hobby angefangen und sehr viel Spaß damit.
Ebenso konnte ich beide Foren kennenlernen.
Auf beiden wurde von einer Gemeinschaft gesprochen.
Aber ganz ehrlich, was ich hier die letzten Tage zu lesen bekam erschüttert mich.
Ihr seid wie diese Fußballcomunity welche sich Hooligans nennen, geht doch auf die Wiese und haut euch die Fresse ein.
Denn mit gemeinsamem Spaß zu haben, hat dies hier nichts zu tun.
Gehabt euch wohl, mit friedvollen Grüßen aus der Pfalz.
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My 2 cents, joined NRG and MSW, posted a couple of build logs Maine and Constitution, somewhat compulsive about it, with much time invested. Still have the pics, if MSW does come back, will not go back to it though, because I saw and agree with the issues Bob talks about. I had no idea they banned people - just for mentioning or discussing something. Can’t run with folks who do that.
Left NRG because of proposed and implemented rules about “bootleg” kits. How on earth can you pass rules about ownership of property, what a member can buy, or speak about? How would this be enforced? Secondary to this was the motto about better shipbuilding through research - better shipbuilding comes through learning the techniques of craftsmanship, in my opinion - that’s ok to each his own.
Back to MSW, the commercial influence became obvious, so creating an extensive build log, creating deep content, benefits who?
Anyway, happy to be over here, see familiar faces. Not sure about another build log, will at least post finished work. Maybe post pictures of USS Maine build as the subject may be unique.
Finally not having an off site back up of an enormous amount of priceless data, well that speaks for itself.
Have a great day,
-Rich
Left NRG because of proposed and implemented rules about “bootleg” kits. How on earth can you pass rules about ownership of property, what a member can buy, or speak about? How would this be enforced? Secondary to this was the motto about better shipbuilding through research - better shipbuilding comes through learning the techniques of craftsmanship, in my opinion - that’s ok to each his own.
Back to MSW, the commercial influence became obvious, so creating an extensive build log, creating deep content, benefits who?
Anyway, happy to be over here, see familiar faces. Not sure about another build log, will at least post finished work. Maybe post pictures of USS Maine build as the subject may be unique.
Finally not having an off site back up of an enormous amount of priceless data, well that speaks for itself.
Have a great day,
-Rich
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Well said. Welcome to SOS!
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The point we have been making was SOS members were often punched in the face and kicked out of the park by the other team.
It would be interesting to get a poll of those MSW banned.
The threats I received made it clear I would also be banned if I said another word supporting an already banned person.
I always had respect for MSW and valued their content.
From then on I simply avoided that nasty individual and ignored his products, though they had intrinsic merits.
I enjoyed the MSW platform and am sad for the members having lost a splendid organ.
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I get where you’re coming from, but some of the points you raised cut both ways.
Creating a build log doesn’t just “benefit the site” it benefits everyone involved. It helps the builder document their own work and receive praise or support, it helps others learn, and it adds to the collective knowledge of the hobby. That’s true here on SOS, on MSW, on Reddit, or anywhere else people share their work. What do you have to say about SOS literally having PayPal payment links right on the home page. If anything, that seems more 'commercially influenced' than anything MSW was doing. If the logic is “why contribute if it benefits the platform,” then the same question applies to every forum on the internet. By that standard, why even converse with other hobbyists at all.
On the MSW banning issue; I agree that some of the historical bans were questionable, but that’s not the MSW I joined or have seen in the last couple of years. The current moderation has been pretty hands off and consistent. Criticizing past decisions is fair, but painting the entire community with that brush doesn’t match the present reality.
I wasn’t aware the NRG had rules about what members can or can’t own. If there’s a specific rule about that, I’d be interested in seeing it, because that’s a bit concerning. As for their motto; it’s been around since 1948. If the goal was historically accurate modeling, then research naturally had to be part of it. I wouldn’t read too much into the wording.
What I have noticed here on SOS over the last few days is a lot of negativity directed at MSW and its members. Some posts almost sound celebratory about the loss, which in turn represents the fact that thousands of hobbyists lost years of logs, references, and techniques. That doesn’t really line up with the idea of SOS being a “safe place” or a community that’s above the drama. Pfalzer summed it up well: acting like rival factions in a sport doesn’t help anyone.
Bottom line is nobody here is better than the people who were affected by the MSW crash, and nobody on MSW is better than anyone here. Both communities have strengths and weaknesses. Criticizing bad admin decisions is fair; dismissing an entire community because of them isn’t taking the high road; it’s just mirroring the same behavior people claim to be against.
I expected this to be an information thread and maybe a place where I'd come across some friendly faces I used to chat with over at MSW and I have, however, at this point, this thread seems to have mostly turned into bickering about how bad MSW is and how great SOS is so I'll stop following this thread.
P.S. If anyone has had contact with David Lester from MSW (looks like he has an account here to but I can't message it) it would be nice to get back in touch with him.
Edit: To be clear, this whole thread has at least opened my eyes to some of the previous banning that was done by MSW and I wholeheartedly disagree with it. When it comes back on line, I would hope they would welcome back some of those members should they wish to re-join and I won't have a second thought about defending that 'free speech' and freedom to do with your money as you please.
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I used both sites equally. The MSW site had some great links on how to do different things. It would be nice to have something like that here.
For example, if there is a spreadsheet for determining ropesize, then it would be handy to have it as a separate link. RIght now when you want to find that, you have to find the right subject matter.
For example, if there is a spreadsheet for determining ropesize, then it would be handy to have it as a separate link. RIght now when you want to find that, you have to find the right subject matter.
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Four of us were prevented from posting on MSW in June of 2024. After that, at least in my case I was allowed to read others posts, but couldn’t respond.
What heinous behavior on my part caused this action?
1. I suggested that those reviewing kits should comment on the historical accuracy of the resulting model.
2. I wrote about things that could be done to improve models of a canoe built from a kit under review. I have personally rebuilt or restored four actual canoes similar to the model in question. My comments were removed by the administrator/ kit reviewer.
3. Someone wanted to build a ship model but couldn’t afford to buy a kit. I responded by saying he might consider carving a “solid hull” model from scrap or inexpensive pine lumber; still my preferred method.
I was not involved in buying kits from pirated or any other sources.
This past winter, after almost two years of not participating in the forum, a friend notified me that one of the administrators was using the names of three us of in a personal and derogatory fashion. After several Email exchanges two NRG board members had to personally remove these slurs from the forum as the administrators had apparently refused to do so.
MSW was useful and the wholesale loss of information is tragic, and I am pleased to welcome refugees from the “crash” here on SOS. If the NRG is able to bring MSW back on line, I hope that they do so under new management.
Note to all: Now that I’ve had my opportunity to vent, I’ll shut up. I’m still a loyal NRG member and in fact paid my 2026 dues in the midst of the recent personal attacks mentioned above.
Roger
What heinous behavior on my part caused this action?
1. I suggested that those reviewing kits should comment on the historical accuracy of the resulting model.
2. I wrote about things that could be done to improve models of a canoe built from a kit under review. I have personally rebuilt or restored four actual canoes similar to the model in question. My comments were removed by the administrator/ kit reviewer.
3. Someone wanted to build a ship model but couldn’t afford to buy a kit. I responded by saying he might consider carving a “solid hull” model from scrap or inexpensive pine lumber; still my preferred method.
I was not involved in buying kits from pirated or any other sources.
This past winter, after almost two years of not participating in the forum, a friend notified me that one of the administrators was using the names of three us of in a personal and derogatory fashion. After several Email exchanges two NRG board members had to personally remove these slurs from the forum as the administrators had apparently refused to do so.
MSW was useful and the wholesale loss of information is tragic, and I am pleased to welcome refugees from the “crash” here on SOS. If the NRG is able to bring MSW back on line, I hope that they do so under new management.
Note to all: Now that I’ve had my opportunity to vent, I’ll shut up. I’m still a loyal NRG member and in fact paid my 2026 dues in the midst of the recent personal attacks mentioned above.
Roger
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It's reassuring to learn that others share the experience of so many of us here on SoS and appreciate its advantages. Like ship modeling itself, SoS is a "big tent." There's room for everybody. Ship modeling is a very diverse pursuit. It can be a hobby to pass the time or an obsessive all-consuming interest. It can be folk art or fine art. There's kit modelers and scratch modelers, wood modelers, metal modelers, plastic modelers, and cardstock modelers, modelers who pursue the highest standards of historical accuracy, and modelers who build models based on their own imaginations, there are beginning modelers and modelers who've been at it longer than others have been alive, there are "tool wonks" with dedicated workshops full of expensive machine tools and hand-craftsmen whittling away with pocket knives and razor blades, and there's room for everybody and we all share what we know and learn from one another.
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What I have noticed here on SOS over the last few days is a lot of negativity directed at MSW and its members.
that is not quite true nothing was ever directed at MSW members or what they build or how or why. Negative comments were directed to the board of NRG directors and at the MSW administration and the way they handled themselves in the past and present. Maybe leave the past in the past but then how do you learn from mistakes and move forward?
Here there are no overlords, no board of directors, no one other than a group of model builders who govern themselves.
i see we all have a lot of baggage, misinformation, dirty deeds done to some and not to others, rumors and such. We need to sort all this out so we can all move in a positive and forward direction. It is possible MSW may not come back and this is all we got so lets make it work
that is not quite true nothing was ever directed at MSW members or what they build or how or why. Negative comments were directed to the board of NRG directors and at the MSW administration and the way they handled themselves in the past and present. Maybe leave the past in the past but then how do you learn from mistakes and move forward?
Here there are no overlords, no board of directors, no one other than a group of model builders who govern themselves.
i see we all have a lot of baggage, misinformation, dirty deeds done to some and not to others, rumors and such. We need to sort all this out so we can all move in a positive and forward direction. It is possible MSW may not come back and this is all we got so lets make it work
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What do you have to say about SOS literally having PayPal payment links right on the home page. If anything, that seems more 'commercially influenced' than anything MSW was doing.
what i have to say is NRG/MSW is a non profit organization and governed by strict IRS rules Ship in Scale is not a non profit or for that matter a for profit organization just a bunch of model builders doing our thing
what i have to say is NRG/MSW is a non profit organization and governed by strict IRS rules Ship in Scale is not a non profit or for that matter a for profit organization just a bunch of model builders doing our thing
I was one of the four banned MSW forum members described above. I was "blocked" from posting on MSW while having one of the highest "best answer" awards on that platform and a substantial number of "followers." I had responded to a novice who was having difficulties and I accurately explained the issues weren't a result of his inexperience but rather were caused by the poorly designed kit he was trying to build. I offered him my advice on how to correct the defect in the kit design. He did and thanked me in the following post for taking the time to help him effectively. MSW did not specify what "misbehavior" warranted my being blocked from posting other than that I had "attacked another forum member" which was nonsense. They deleted that, my most recent post, in which I explained what was wrong with the poorly designed kit but left the original poster's question and "thank you" post which bracketed it to remain. I wonder if anybody ever even noticed what I posted other than the original poster but, obviously, I incurred the wrath of one of the kit manufacturers who had taken over running MSW and determined I had to be excluded.
As far as I'm concerned, MSW was and is their forum and they are completely entitled to do whatever they want with it. Of course, conversely, my opinions about MSW are similarly my own and I am completely entitled to whatever I want with them, as well.
What became apparent over time was that the management of MSW had been taken over by a small number of kit vendors who promoted a "cult of personality" and appropriated the MSW platform for the advertisement of their businesses and products. Thereafter, these managers embarked upon a pogrom to exterminate any criticism of ship model kits and any encouragement of scratch-building ship models, all to the benefit of the vendors who controlled the MSW platform.
MSW's management's actions actions against what recent posts in this forum have revealed to be a far greater number of modelers than any of us would have ever imagined betrays the fact that they are not interested in the ship modeling hobby as much as they are interested in their own commercial interests and, for that reason, are not worthy of my respect, regardless of the quality of their products.
There has been much wailing and gnashing of teeth over the "loss" of valuable data occasioned by MSW's "crash" without an effectively operational back-up system. I would suggest that any serious ship modeler do what many modelers do and maintain separate digital files and also hard-copy paper files, of information they encounter in online forums and wish to retain as reference material. I must admit that I don't do this enough and I am inconvenienced as are many others by the MSW database loss, but if it's any consolation, there is very little, if anything that was in the MSW database that isn't available in a book or on another internet platform. Let the loss of MSW be a lesson for everyone that relying on the internet or any other digital data storage and retreival system is not always secure and that the wise ship modeler will build and maintain a a hard-copy library of books and filed articles in addition to relying on finding anything they may need to know on the internet,.
The topic past it’s purpose and for that reason closed for further discussion .I guess everyone knows alreadyvwhat happened with MSW forum.
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