OcCre San Filipe Rigging HELP!

bargejo said:
The OcCre Victory (an unexpected gift from my wife) is to be my next project so even while frustrated, I’m glad to have the San Felipe to practice on. I’ve already purchased the recommended Victory reference books because it’s a certainty that I’m going to need them. I’ll be following your journey with inter
Mwentling said:
Unfortunately, I had packed up the workshop and put the house on the market for sale. But the market is so soft right it homes are simply not selling. So over the next month or so, I’ll bring my shop back from storage, unpack and get things set-up again. Having never built a PoF frame before, I am going to build the USS Constitution cut-way from Model Expo first, and then hopefully start on the Victory this fall. I need to build some basic skills on ships before I tackle the Victory. This was my shop before I packed up, that is a WACO Biplane frame on the worktable, the wingspan will be 109” when complete. I am coming over from the stick built RC world.

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WOW . That is a very nice place for building.
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LuigiSoft said:
I am in the process of building the Endeavour from OccRe and in agreement with all those modellers who are building ships from OcCre the rigging plans are, to say the least, challenging. The company did some fine work on the hull and deck furniture, including the masts, but seem to have lost interest in the rigging. I am frustrated with the rigging plans and reverted to Marquardt's book "The anatomy of the ship" and to Petersson's "Rigging period ship models" for better details.
I found when rigging is to work from the inside to the outside of the ship, otherwise it becomes fiddly when attempting to tie some of the running rigging in place when all the standing rigging is applied. I suppose it's a matter of choice. I will display the ship without sails.
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The Endeavour is a beautiful ship, it was my first wood build and I took 11 months to complete. the plans were sketchy as said, but, YouTube University and some tips from the guys here helped me thru it as I had no idea what I was doing coming from plastic builds. I'm currently finishing up the HMS Diana which has been a nightmare as all that could go wrong, did! and the rigging plans I may as well have thrown them out. Many parts missing and some not enough of. But, again, the forum got me thru it. The Flying Dutchman is my next build and I will probably invest in one of the rigging books. Have fun on the Endeavour.
 
Sorry for my typos, I am glueing.(
Drawing E is for the bowsprit, Mn. and top masts
Drawing G is the foremast running rigging.
Again sorry for the typos.
Bill
 
bargejo- You may find "The Rigging of Ships" by Anderson to be of enormous help. The book is cheap & is packed with invaluable info....from Danish ship-rigging to French, English & Dutch. There isn't much on Spanish ships I can find anywhere, but imagination & improvisation can be used, to a certain extent. Rigging ships can be slow & frustrating at times, but I enjoyed that more than anything. Good Luck on a beautiful build!
Rick 1011
 
OcCre has only a very basic, and very simplified a Rigging plan on this model. See attached diagram.
If you would like to buy our blocks and make a proper rigging for this nice model you can contact us.
Then such a Rigging plan would look similar to, for example, the Royal William model you can find: Royal William - accessories
And you can download the rigging plans with our blocks: Royal William - rigging plans
If you have any further questions, please write.
I wish you continued enthusiasm to complete a nice model.
Sincerely Radimir

San Felipe - OcCre - rigging B.jpg
 
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bargejo said:
HELP! I’ve finished the hull and stepped the masts (OcCre 1/87 San Felipe 1690) and was looking ahead at the rigging plans. The standing rigging I can figure out, but the ‘plans’ for the running rigging have no identifications as to which mast is being referred to. I’ve always heard that OcCre is pretty casual when it comes to rigging instructions but what is provided is borderline ridiculous. Does anyone know what parts are being referred to on the plans labeled E,G, and H? Are they Fore, Main, Mizzen or simply showing one ‘typical’ mast rigging scheme for main, top, topgallant? I’ve messaged OcCre but their customer service is on par with their rigging instructions so I’m not too optimistic. I’m not accomplished enough to free lance it and I’ve already attached all the blocks to all the yards per OcCre’s diagrams so I’m not sure things would line up if I used a generic or ‘typical’ rigging plan. Suggestions?

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Congratulations, a beautiful model
I'm thinking of building the San Felipe next. How would you rate the materials quality in this kit
Happy modeling
Ted
 
bargejo said:
HELP! I’ve finished the hull and stepped the masts (OcCre 1/87 San Felipe 1690) and was looking ahead at the rigging plans. The standing rigging I can figure out, but the ‘plans’ for the running rigging have no identifications as to which mast is being referred to. I’ve always heard that OcCre is pretty casual when it comes to rigging instructions but what is provided is borderline ridiculous. Does anyone know what parts are being referred to on the plans labeled E,G, and H? Are they Fore, Main, Mizzen or simply showing one ‘typical’ mast rigging scheme for main, top, topgallant? I’ve messaged OcCre but their customer service is on par with their rigging instructions so I’m not too optimistic. I’m not accomplished enough to free lance it and I’ve already attached all the blocks to all the yards per OcCre’s diagrams so I’m not sure things would line up if I used a generic or ‘typical’ rigging plan. Suggestions?

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Did you try reaching OcCre for suggestion on ideas. I am sure we could help if you still need it. Please let me know how we can help you.
 
The plans of occre are general and it is necessary to examine the plan very well before starting. I also encountered the same problem during the construction of the kit "Golden Hind", but I agree with Master Filski's message number 9... Please follow the numbers on the plan, this will be very useful for you. For example, follow the number that says j44, you will see it going down from under the observation tower on the front mast...
 
OcCre appears to take great pains to help the builder through the process of constructing their kits. The pictorial instructions, inclusion of forms and jigs, the excellent ‘Paso a Paso’ YouTube series (for the moment I’ll gloss over the rather consistent and annoying habit of switching focus and introducing new kit series before the older series are properly completed) all seem to show a passion for helping the builder, especially those of us who are newer to the hobby. EXCEPT when it comes to rigging. After spending a year meticulously working on the ship through 40+ pages of photos and 40+ videos, the final crowning step of rigging and sails concludes with a couple of line drawings, a lot of numbers, and virtually no identification of what you’re supposed to be looking at. It’s difficult for me to understand why nobody at OcCre seems to really care about communicating this part of the build with the same thoughtfulness that they have in leading up to this very important end.

OcCre has a reputation of being build friendly. To most of the ‘old salts’ on this forum I’m sure OcCre’s subtle lack of consistent scale, the glossing over of detail, the commonality of parts across kits, and the build simplification process, cause them to choose other kit makers, or they have the amazing and enviable ability to scratch build or heavily modify their own masterpieces. I have learned so much from following the many build logs and am exceedingly grateful of how helpful the members are in answering newbie questions and guiding us through our frustrations, they’ve all been there, done that. For me, coming to the hobby at 74, OcCre has met me where I am, and has given me the opportunity to create something that amazes my friends and astounds my enemies, and is providing hours of personal enjoyment in my retirement. I just wish they’d take a similar approach to the rigging. Newbies are rule followers, yeah, we’ve bought the books but are only just learning to take those first few hesitant steps out into the deeper ends of the kit building pool.

Now that I’ve got that off my chest….I’m figuring it out as I go and muddling through. I now realize that OcCre’s rigging follows a similar pattern across kits just like their build processes and that it’s fairly standard and generic. For my level of expertise, it will do. Perhaps on the next one I’ll try my hand at making a mouse, or learn how to properly seize a block, or add open heart blocks where they should be, and most importantly, buy Ropes of Scale. But for now, I’m like the dancing dog, I’m just damn appreciative of being able to do something I’ve wanted to do for 50 years and do it at all. And as everyone continually says, only I know how bad it is. IMG_0943.jpeg
 
bargejo said:
OcCre appears to take great pains to help the builder through the process of constructing their kits. The pictorial instructions, inclusion of forms and jigs, the excellent ‘Paso a Paso’ YouTube series (for the moment I’ll gloss over the rather consistent and annoying habit of switching focus and introducing new kit series before the older series are properly completed) all seem to show a passion for helping the builder, especially those of us who are newer to the hobby. EXCEPT when it comes to rigging. After spending a year meticulously working on the ship through 40+ pages of photos and 40+ videos, the final crowning step of rigging and sails concludes with a couple of line drawings, a lot of numbers, and virtually no identification of what you’re supposed to be looking at. It’s difficult for me to understand why nobody at OcCre seems to really care about communicating this part of the build with the same thoughtfulness that they have in leading up to this very important end.

OcCre has a reputation of being build friendly. To most of the ‘old salts’ on this forum I’m sure OcCre’s subtle lack of consistent scale, the glossing over of detail, the commonality of parts across kits, and the build simplification process, cause them to choose other kit makers, or they have the amazing and enviable ability to scratch build or heavily modify their own masterpieces. I have learned so much from following the many build logs and am exceedingly grateful of how helpful the members are in answering newbie questions and guiding us through our frustrations, they’ve all been there, done that. For me, coming to the hobby at 74, OcCre has met me where I am, and has given me the opportunity to create something that amazes my friends and astounds my enemies, and is providing hours of personal enjoyment in my retirement. I just wish they’d take a similar approach to the rigging. Newbies are rule followers, yeah, we’ve bought the books but are only just learning to take those first few hesitant steps out into the deeper ends of the kit building pool.

Now that I’ve got that off my chest….I’m figuring it out as I go and muddling through. I now realize that OcCre’s rigging follows a similar pattern across kits just like their build processes and that it’s fairly standard and generic. For my level of expertise, it will do. Perhaps on the next one I’ll try my hand at making a mouse, or learn how to properly seize a block, or add open heart blocks where they should be, and most importantly, buy Ropes of Scale. But for now, I’m like the dancing dog, I’m just damn appreciative of being able to do something I’ve wanted to do for 50 years and do it at all. And as everyone continually says, only I know how bad it is. View attachment 514054
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BeerBeerBeerBeer What a great job
 
I don't remember if they state it in their instructions, but in the rigging diagrams, Red lines are standing rigging (help the masts and things stand up) and the blue lines are running rigging (needed to "run" the sails). If you are not putting sails on your ship (they are this way when they plan to be docked for a little while or more), you can ignore all the blue lines.

A recommendation I will make is that as you install rigging lines, you highlight them with a highlighter (what ever color you think will work best. I like green).

Hope that helps a little bit.
 
Thanks Corsair, and to all the other contributors. A lot of the help offered in this thread is EXACTLY what OcCre ought to have done in the first place. What would it have cost them to simply identify the masts or to offer a few guiding instructions? Oh well, water under the keel. I’ve now completed the rigging and will tackle the sails next. Too bad there aren’t any instructions as to where all the blocks go on each of the sails and how many there are. Another learning opportunity.
 
Greetings - your Standing rigging is nicely done. And if you confirm to me that you're really interested - that doesn't obligate you to buy the sets of pulleys I'll suggest, I'll prepare a rigging plan for running rigging.
And if you are interested, let me know if you prefer a more basic option - with the basic types of ropes needed to handle jibs and sails. Or are you interested in a of complete Running rigging design.
And I can prepare a proposal accordingly. Well, and you get an idea of what pulleys to use and where what goes. And then you'll can decided if you use my offer or no.
Radimir
 
Here is an example of a running rigging plan for a 17th century ship from the European continent (French in this case). See attached. some lines differ from an 18th century vessel, but this is the sort of information you are looking for. For San Felipe, a fictional Spanish ship, you want to look for a continental European rigging style, not an English one, because there are noteable differences. There are books on rigging out there which can help. Since 18th century style ships are not my strong suit, I defer to the advice from other members here.
 

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I found some rigging plans from Mantua which are quite good, especially the belaying plan. Know that San Felipe is a fictional vessel based on Spanish designs of the 1740's not 1690. It's popularity comes from how beautiful the design is. THe stern galleries are not similar to Spanish vessels, and are a unique design.
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Thanks all for your help. In the end I decided to go with the basic OcRe plan (which you all helped me figure out) but I definitely want to take several steps up for my next kit and these are all extremely valuable aides. This has definitely been one of those projects where I sigh and say “if I only knew when I was building it where I would end up I would have done it a bit differently and asked for advice a bit earlier”. I suppose that’s why everyone says it’s a journey, not a one stop destination hobby. I’ve learned a lot, probably the most important lesson is to always be looking forward to where you’re going so that you have the opportunity to adjust things before you get there. For newbies, that’s a difficult habit to get into because we tend to follow instructions literally one step at a time and just assume we’ll end up in the right place. To quote Lee Corso, “not so fast my friend”. Next up, the sails.

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