HMS Beagle 1/60

[Swabbie]

Argh, me maties! It has been a long time since I was on this forum. It already feels good to be back.

I hope I did not step off the plank by attempting to build a larger wooden model (compared to what I have done before).

Anyway, I just bought the Occre HMS Beagle 1/60 kit. I should receive it by early December.
In the meantime, I also ordered the book HMS Beagle: the story of Darwin's ship. Also spent a full day researching what I am about to get myself into. The more I learn, the shallower the waters seem to become.

 

[zoly99sask]

Welcome back!

 

[Swabbie]

Thanks, zoly99sask, for your welcome.

Well, after a full day of research on the actual construction of the HMS Beagle, I am lost as to what is real. The original plans for the ship were either lost or drawn from memory, as opposed to how the ship was actually redesigned and built for Charles Darwin's mission. I will just have to settle for the model manufacturer's idea of how the ship should look. However, I will not have the beagle-dog figurehead, for it was only an idea that was not used in its construction.

So, since the ship design is fairly open to 'points of view', I will make certain choices I am sure others may disagree with. I am looking forward to reading the book HMS Beagle: The Story of Darwin's Ship. It may either settle what I can and cannot do to this model, or throw me off the plank to swim in my own direction. Meaning, I am prepared to change things, if I can, about this model kit to make it right for me. After all, I want to enjoy the build by being creative.

 

[Pepite 1/60]

A Cherokee-class brig sloop (as the Beagle originally was build).

 

[Pepite 1/60]

The Occre version certainly comes a lot closer to the original than Mamoli/Constructo. They are just somewhat modified 'Bounty's).

 

[GrantTyler]

Welcome back Peter. Have fun and enjoy this project. Cheers Grant

 

[Swabbie]

@Pepite 1/60 , thank you for your posts.
I did read something about the Cherokee and the Beagle plan of 1831.

From what I found out today, the original HMS Beagle was modified at the time Darwin needed the ship. It changed from a warship to a surveying ship. The deck was raised to accommodate more storage room for equipment and a collection of Darwin's findings. The raised deck stabilized the Ship more so in rough seas (where before, the boat was unsafe under such conditions). Other things were changed as well, but the new versions, or plans, kept changing by various people who were not qualified to do so. As a result, the plans got lost in the confusion along the way. Later, it was impossible to compare the plans to the Beagle after the ship was lost. There are more sketches (made from memory) than there were plans, each different from the others. I think this is why every HMS Beagle model manufacturer shows what they think the Beagle looked like when Darwin sailed in her.

 

[Swabbie]

Thank you, @GrantTyler, for your welcome.

 

[DAWarden-(Jaager)]

There is also: HMS Beagle: Survey Ship Extraordinary (Anatomy of the Ship) by Karl Heinz Marquardt

A complete monograph - except as with other AOTS monographs - no adequate full size lines.

It is a bit costly. generally $200. Everything you could possibly want to know and more.

another book
The Voyage of the Beagle: Darwin's Extraordinary Adventure aboard Fitroy's Famous Survey Ship Hardcover – October 1, 2008
by James Taylor

Please, please give serious thought to not following the OcCre deck layout. A deck built with a planking butt on the same beam in every other strake would pass no contract and a civilian craft with that deck would never get insurance.

ASA 1870
Sec. 25. -The upper or main deck planking should be
of the greatest obtainable length, and free from
defects, close-jointed and fastened with two spikes in
each beam, and one in each carling.
No butts of adjoining plank should be nearer
each other than the space of two beams (when a
strake intervenes the distance of one beam will be
allowed). No butts should meet on the same beam,
unless there be three strakes between them.
No plank should be caulked until throughly
fastened to the timbers; the treenails should also be
wedged on the inside, and cross-caulked or wedged
outside, before the seams are opened

The trunnels and spikes were covered with plugs of the same wood as the deck and the grain in alignment with the deck's.
Essentially - they were all but invisible. There certainly would not have been only two black spikes at each end.
About the caulking - when wood swells and contracts it is across the grain. Wood does not change length. A Grand Canyon width caulking is not needed there.

The USN in the same class of ship, at this time the gun deck: "Heart Pine free of sap 3.5" thick and not more than 10" wide average length 40'. To be fastened with 8" iron spikes 7" spikes in the ledges - (Spikes) are to be punched down so as to admit above the heads a Heart Pine plug to be put in dipped in white lead, 3/4" in thickness."

For the RN, the Swedes and Finns may not have been able to match Georgia or South Carolina for the 40' length, but long was what was wanted.

Mamoli/Constructo. They are just somewhat modified 'Bounty's).

When I looked at the catalog photos, I thought that Beagle, Endeavour, and Bounty were the same hull. It is reassuring not to be alone about that.

 

[Pathfinder65]

Welcome back, I look forward to following your build log.

Jan

 

[Swabbie]

There is also: HMS Beagle: Survey Ship Extraordinary (Anatomy of the Ship) by Karl Heinz Marquardt

A complete monograph - except as with other AOTS monographs - no adequate full size lines.

It is a bit costly. generally $200. Everything you could possibly want to know and more.

another book
The Voyage of the Beagle: Darwin's Extraordinary Adventure aboard Fitroy's Famous Survey Ship Hardcover – October 1, 2008
by James Taylor
'''

Thank you, DAWarden, for your book recommendations.

Yes, the first book is too expensive, even for second hand ones. But I found a free PDF version, however the illustrated sections were too small to read the text, yet the drawings are quite revealing. As for the James Taylor book, which is affordable as a used book, has just been ordered.

 

[Swabbie]

... Please, please give serious thought to not following the OcCre deck layout. A deck built with a planking butt on the same beam in every other strake would pass no contract and a civilian craft with that deck would never get insurance.

ASA 1870
Sec. 25. -The upper or main deck planking should be
of the greatest obtainable length, and free from
defects, close-jointed and fastened with two spikes in
each beam, and one in each carling.
No butts of adjoining plank should be nearer
each other than the space of two beams (when a
strake intervenes the distance of one beam will be
allowed). No butts should meet on the same beam,
unless there be three strakes between them.
No plank should be caulked until throughly
fastened to the timbers; the treenails should also be
wedged on the inside, and cross-caulked or wedged
outside, before the seams are opened

The trunnels and spikes were covered with plugs of the same wood as the deck and the grain in alignment with the deck's.
Essentially - they were all but invisible. There certainly would not have been only two black spikes at each end.
About the caulking - when wood swells and contracts it is across the grain. Wood does not change length. A Grand Canyon width caulking is not needed there.

The USN in the same class of ship, at this time the gun deck: "Heart Pine free of sap 3.5" thick and not more than 10" wide average length 40'. To be fastened with 8" iron spikes 7" spikes in the ledges - (Spikes) are to be punched down so as to admit above the heads a Heart Pine plug to be put in dipped in white lead, 3/4" in thickness."

For the RN, the Swedes and Finns may not have been able to match Georgia or South Carolina for the 40' length, but long was what was wanted.
...

Thanks again DAWarden. I am afraid you lost me here. I am only a first year student when it comes to ships, and a lot of the shiplore jargon still baffles me.
However, if I am required to make changes to the deck to be more accurate, I will pass on that approach for this build. If I were scratch-building the Beagle, I would take such advice more seriously and most probably heed to it. Even so, I am grateful for your concerning advice.

 

[Swabbie]

@Pathfinder65, Thank you, for your welcome.

 

[Swabbie]

Well, I just learnt that the Occre kit is not a sound copy of how the HMS Beagle ought to have been built. This is devastating to the little perfectionist part of me who has an "All or Nothing" motto.

But I have already invested hundreds of dollars into the Occre kit, so I am going to build it anyway. I will not be concerned about accuracy or how the ship ought to be built (shock-horror ).

Actually, this change of plan is a blessing.

My new plan is to build the ship with alterations to suit my taste. In fact, right now, I can feel my creative juices being stirred up. Yes, this is what I am meant to do to feel authentic to my innate quirky nature. My past SOS builds bare witness to this.

I now have a new and refreshing point of view about this build. My new motto is "Anything is Possible".

 

[DAWarden-(Jaager)]

Putting a bow on the Beagle accuracy aspect - now - I would start with a print of ZAZ5137
and directly use ZAZ5136 reverse side

and Marquardt for the alterations done for survey voyage #3. It might be that the raised deck, new chart room, higher bulwarks, mizzen mast, perhaps shift of main and maybe foremast were done without Whitehall plans being drawn first. There may never have been official documentation.

My new plan is to build the ship with alterations to suit my taste.

Why not? An inaccurate kit as the base pretty much precludes any possibility an accurate finished product. Nothing of any academic level accuracy is possible.
I think that these coffin brigs are the RN's second largest class. There were differences among the sisters. But when only fun is possible, the gloves are pretty much off as far as possible variations.

 

[Swabbie]

Thank you, @DAWarden-(Jaager), for your input. We will see what comes from it.

 

[Mikey]

Thank you, @GrantTyler, for your welcome.

Well, I just learnt that the Occre kit is not a sound copy of how the HMS Beagle ought to have been built. This is devastating to the little perfectionist part of me who has an "All or Nothing" motto.

But I have already invested hundreds of dollars into the Occre kit, so I am going to build it anyway. I will not be concerned about accuracy or how the ship ought to be built (shock-horror ).

Actually, this change of plan is a blessing.

My new plan is to build the ship with alterations to suit my taste. In fact, right now, I can feel my creative juices being stirred up. Yes, this is what I am meant to do to feel authentic to my innate quirky nature. My past SOS builds bare witness to this.

I now have a new and refreshing point of view about this build. My new motto is "Anything is Possible".

I found the same issue with the kit after reading and examining the Marquardt book. I found differing dimensions on the hatches and deck furniture, although the kit is close. The biggest issue I had was with the decking dimensions- the correct scale leads to a lot more planking of narrower planks. Not to mention the main planks supporting the masts and hull. This lends a much better perception of the correct scale. The belay pins in the kit are also way off. I have attached a photo of my Beagle with a forecastle following the Marquardt drawings. Still not to my satisfaction; but I have a second kit where I will correct my errors.

 

[Swabbie]

Thank you, Mickey, for sharing your experience and build of this model. Very nicely made, with your mods and touches. You have given me some ideas... thanks.

 

[Swabbie]

Hello Maties. I need your help. I have a Question...

 

[Smithy]

Hello Maties. I need your help. I have a Question...

View attachment 557246

.They are a rather poor suggestion of the crew’s hammocks.

I remember this kit Well from about three years ago when I tried to build it. Ultimately, I failed but it wasn’t really the fault of the kit. I made several rash modifications trying to get close to the AOTS book and ended up making the whole thing into a bit of a mess.

There is a full-size ‘replica’ of the beagle somewhere in South America. You can find it with a Google search . It’s not actually a boat but rather something like a fairground attraction built on a hill. I have a feeling that Occre might have used it as inspiration for certain parts of their model.