initial Soleil royal using the heller 1/100 scale kit (post prepared in advance)

That is the easy job:)) now you have to cut the excess all around the pieces without cutting off parts of them:)))) Then you'll need to make floors on 2 levels and a ceiling on the upper one:))))
 
GuyM said:
That is the easy job:)) now you have to cut the excess all around the pieces without cutting off parts of them:)))) Then you'll need to make floors on 2 levels and a ceiling on the upper one:))))
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Oh yes, I forgot; you need to adapt the curved gun port on the top battery:)
 
aurélien wolff said:
What do you guys think of Michel Saulnier analysis of the Tanneron soleil royal? To him, it's "Le foudroyant" renamed Soleil royal, not even the intial or post refit soleil royal of 1669/1688. Being honest, I do find Lemineur/Saulnier analysis has issues since, as Guy M showed in his research, the Tanneron model can still be interpreted in a multitude of ways. I'm more on the interpretation that Tanneron wanted to represent the 1st soleil royal using the data at his disposal from both versions. https://www.leradoubduponant.com/t6...-pas-le-sr-fourni-dans-tous-les-kits-existant
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With all the respect I have for him, he is mistaking on his interpretation; Lemineur did say the first Soleil Royal was designed as a 16 port ship, but the rest of the story isn't what happened; the rebuilt Soleil Royal did inherit a 15th gun port on the top battery, but only after his return from an expedition in 1691; the ship had been rebuilt as a 110 gun ship and did carry as much for a short while after Tourville's return from Bezeviers. As for the exchange in 1691, both ships would have been lower on the stern and both ships had 14 port openings; furthermore, both ship had identical number of guns with the same layout; and that layout varied for Lagos, where the second Soleil Royal also got an extra pair of 12 lbs on the top battery as with the previous one bringing the number to 15 ports on each side; the decor of the Soleil Royal/Foudroyant remained the same after the switch, where as the Foudroyant/Soleil Royal decor was changed and yes, they were given a sketch of Berain's decor to replace what was on there. One needs to remember that by the end of the century, most bottles were now closed and the rear galleries were much shallower or non existant; there were no galleries for the lower level from 1673, just the decorated base holding pillars or statues....
 
aurélien wolff said:
What do you guys think of Michel Saulnier analysis of the Tanneron soleil royal? To him, it's "Le foudroyant" renamed Soleil royal, not even the intial or post refit soleil royal of 1669/1688. Being honest, I do find Lemineur/Saulnier analysis has issues since, as Guy M showed in his research, the Tanneron model can still be interpreted in a multitude of ways. I'm more on the interpretation that Tanneron wanted to represent the 1st soleil royal using the data at his disposal from both versions. https://www.leradoubduponant.com/t6...-pas-le-sr-fourni-dans-tous-les-kits-existant
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Sorry, the second Soleil Royal (1692) got his extra 12 lbs AFTER Lagos......
 
The museum uses both 1689/1693 date so even them aren't sure on wich it's supposed to represent https://www.modelships.de/Museums_and_replicas/Musee_de_la_Marine_Paris/Photos_Soleil_Royal.htm And while tanneron used berain drawing as a source since berain kept as much as he could of the 1st ship stern façade, he still deviated a lot from it, less windows(can be a artistic license too), a different pediment, wich can correspond to the intention of making the 1st soleil royal.
 
aurélien wolff said:
The museum uses both 1689/1693 date so even them aren't sure on wich it's supposed to represent https://www.modelships.de/Museums_and_replicas/Musee_de_la_Marine_Paris/Photos_Soleil_Royal.htm And while tanneron used berain drawing as a source since berain kept as much as he could of the 1st ship stern façade, he still deviated a lot from it, less windows(can be a artistic license too), a different pediment, wich can correspond to the intention of making the 1st soleil royal.
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He didn't only use Berain's drawing as a reference; he also used the ceiling painting cnfiguration which De La Rivière drew in order to be able to transfer the whole design on the rebuilt ship; it shows 5 main windows and maybe two small ones (see document), where ther ship is at its largest at the ''chambre des volontaires'' he may also have had access to a drawing made by Puget along with a description of the stern decor and the top of the bottle decor...He also used a descripton of Le Brun's decor for the front.... Where he did interpret the stern is in the shape of the bottles or galleries, and the lower level columns holding the upper level. You can find a very similar design on the Louis XV at the museum....
 
So the 5 windows design came from the "chambre des volontaires" drawing who show it as it'd look like on the 1st SR before the refit, he choosed to extrapolate the 5 windows for the deck above.
 
If there were 5 main windows and two smaller panels, or windows at the largest part, going up would have given enough space for 5 windows; don't forget Tanneron may have had access to a Puget drawing also....
 
So back to 5 for the space above the "chambre des volontaires", got it. Doesn't this mean one can keep the heller windows while enlarging the model a bit for the 2 smaller panels/windows. I'll have to draw plan for the façade to know and show what I want to do.
 
aurélien wolff said:
So back to 5 for the space above the "chambre des volontaires", got it. Doesn't this mean one can keep the heller windows while enlarging the model a bit for the 2 smaller panels/windows. I'll have to draw plan for the façade to know and show what I want to do.
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I think ti is possible to fit triangular shaped windows on the lower level without modifying the whole rear strusture; but I have not tried that and bare in mind that those two spaces at the ends may very well ahve simply been panels or ''false windows...
 
So what tanneron did on the windows is right for a 1st soleil royal:
g1669_Soleil_Royal_045.jpg

Should I open the middle one like he did on his model? Souldn't fitting the panels/small windows still mean enlarging the rear with the stern façade a bit tho.
 
Yes, the 5 window layout is right for the first iteration of the ship;
There is some space already there; I think carefully cutting out the little flat panel there and making and extra window ''beam'' to separate would fit the actual measures....But, as I said, I have not tried it out.....
 
GuyM said:
Yes, the 5 window layout is right for the first iteration of the ship;
There is some space already there; I think carefully cutting out the little flat panel there and making and extra window ''beam'' to separate would fit the actual measures....But, as I said, I have not tried it out.....
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I am making partially opened doors on the two lower levels; but i used an extra stern face for that; I think there had to be doors there, so it's up to you if you want to cut them out or not....
 
He can do whatever he wants:) so can you....This pic of the front would be from the rebuilt version, but the ''porte hauban'' are too high;
they should be below the top battery;
 
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