Macedonian, a British Frigate of 38 guns,c.1812, in 1:36 scale for RC sailing

[Roger Pellett]

Lots of Classics there.

 

[JerryTodd]

Initially, I was going to put the same brace-winch set-up in Macedonian that I have in Constellation, but trying to control the tacks of the courses with flat winches wasn't going to work. Keeping the braces on their drums without any gear-shifting (like the derailer on a 10-speed bycycle).
I stuck Mac's pallet with her brace winches in a vice to do something to it, when it struck me to plug a winch servo in and play with the idea of turning the winches on their sides. It seemed to work well, even with significant slack in the lines. I 3D modeled the idea, to figure out how I'd mount the servos.

Recently, while doing some research for a web-page on RC sail controls, I came across a video on Youtube where Georg Reinbold explains the brace winches on his bark Nernberg. The function was as I had found with my experiment above, but it was the way it was built that really appealed to me.

So I drew up a rig specifically to fit Macedonian. I mounted the winch drums for each mast on a single frame because unlike Nernberg, I'm not actively controlling every yard; like Constellation, I'm only controlling the tops'l yard on each mast, and the tacks of the fore and main course sails. The tacks because that what matters when sailing a square-rigger on the wind. The frame holding the drums will sit on a pair of beams fixed inside the hull. The servo mounts will be on a small deck below that, probably resting on another pair of beams. Another 3D model was made to check sizes and clearances.

I looked closely at the construction of Georg's winch drums to see how the braces are attached (and a failed first attempt show in another of his videos). It seems there's a hole in the axle at each drum, and the brace is threaded through and knotted.
I'm concerned the knot could interfere with or snag the brace as the drum turns, so I'm thinking of using a larger diameter brass tube instead of a rod, for the axles. The brace would thread through the hole in the drum and into the tube, and it's knot would be inside the tube.
Hopefully this will allow me to rig the tacks on the courses, and if it all comes together, I'll probably retrofit it to Constellation.

 

[JJ Lad]

It would seem that one would benefit of more effective tacking by pulling in the jibs, and letting out the spanker. Although less sheet area, the forces at work benefit from greater leverage around the point of rotation.

 

[JerryTodd]

In my set-up, the heads'l are on two-arms driven by a single arm on a servo. Since the heads'ls all overlap each-other, and have to cross-over stays when tacking, my set-up casts off the sheets, but can also pull the windward sheet to box-the-head. Additionally, the squares on the fore-mast are driven on a separate winch from the main and mizzen, so it can be used to box-the-head as well - just as it works on the real thing.
drawing of the two brace winches and "semophore-heads'l-sheeter"; photo of the set-up through the main hatch; and Constellation coming-about with the heads'ls and foremast sails aback.


Tacking, or coming-about, isn't what I'm trying to address; I'm concerned with setting the courses when sailing close-hauled by controlling the clews as they are on the real ships by using the tacks. Constellation's winches are flat, and move to maintain tension of the braces. Because of that, they can run a fixed-loop circuit, or maintain constant tension on a simple tack/sheet loop with the danger of the line falling off it's place on the winch-drum - derailing.
Turning the winch-drums vertical reduces the problem because the over-sized flanges keep any slack on the correct drum.
Some may not get my explanation of it until you see it in action

I played with the 3D model to simplify it by putting the servo mounts on the frame with the drums, the whole unit sits on a pair of beams fixed inside the hull. I was real pleased with this arrangement until I saw a problem; there's no way to install or remove a servo. I'm a big proponent of access for repair and maintenance, and I don't want to alter or damage the servos (voiding any warranties) so catching issues like this are why I modeled it in 3D first.


The fix was actually fairly simple; the drums and fairleads are on their own frame, with the servos on their own separate frame that's removable from the beams and will allow the servos to be mounted or unmounted as required - see exploded view.

 

[JJ Lad]

I understand... however my original comment remains germane. You've created a complex engineering solution that will demand increased maintenance and presents multiple failure points.

Course setting can be tuned with jib and spanker placement. Of course your radio will need sufficient proportional channels to support these functions.

Current IOM hull designs recognize these risks and locate their winches with simplicity and maintenance access as top priority.

And where our scale-models are typically not raced, I would rather not have to spend my time dock side untangling my running-rigging.

 

[JerryTodd]

You've created a complex engineering solution that will demand increased maintenance and presents multiple failure points.

I've looked at loads of convoluted, over-engineered, cat's-cradles and simplified it while still getting the functionality and appearance I'm after.
How complex is my set-up compared to...

What you see as complexity is no more complex than remote controlled window blinds. I'm controlling only three of 12 yards, with two winches,designed to be accessible and removable if something needs servicing. I'm not bunting or furling any sails, no search-lights, radars, running lights, sound effects, firing guns, or any other fuwafuwa gimmicks.
The level of complexity is higher than a one meter yacht because remotely controlling a 19th century full-rigged ship model that weighs 80-100 pounds is more complex than a 2-sail sloop with a self tending rig.
My Constellation already successfully uses a more complex set-up than I'm planning for Macedonian, and both models use only 4 channels (rudder, fore-n-afts, fore-mast, main/mizzen-mast).

I, and I'm sure others reading here, would like to see your idea of how to set this up on-deck as you suggested.

 

[JJ Lad]

I've looked at loads of convoluted, over-engineered, cat's-cradles and simplified it while still getting the functionality and appearance I'm after.
How complex is my set-up compared to...
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What you see as complexity is no more complex than remote controlled window blinds. I'm controlling only three of 12 yards, with two winches,designed to be accessible and removable if something needs servicing. I'm not bunting or furling any sails, no search-lights, radars, running lights, sound effects, firing guns, or any other fuwafuwa gimmicks.
The level of complexity is higher than a one meter yacht because remotely controlling a 19th century full-rigged ship model that weighs 80-100 pounds is more complex than a 2-sail sloop with a self tending rig.
My Constellation already successfully uses a more complex set-up than I'm planning for Macedonian, and both models use only 4 channels (rudder, fore-n-afts, fore-mast, main/mizzen-mast).

I, and I'm sure others reading here, would like to see your idea of how to set this up on-deck as you suggested.

A project in progress.

All surface mounted winches with no sub-deck running rigging…. configured to accomdate jib, mains and spanker control.

 

[JerryTodd]

Macedonian won't have deck houses to hide winches in, and I'm certainly not going to have exposed servos on deck. Why do you assume my set-up will be prone to fail and unserviceable? I already have a model that's sailed several times successfully. I want my models to operate realistically, and that means braces routed as the prototype was, and fore-n-afts not sheeted right to the centerline.
You do realize pretty much every traditional style RC model boat has it's controls below decks; even the Bearospace boats.

The only failure here was a t'gallant clew coming unhooked: Constellation on the Miles River

 

[JJ Lad]

Macedonian won't have deck houses to hide winches in, and I'm certainly not going to have exposed servos on deck. Why do you assume my set-up will be prone to fail and unserviceable? I already have a model that's sailed several times successfully. I want my models to operate realistically, and that means braces routed as the prototype was, and fore-n-afts not sheeted right to the centerline.
You do realize pretty much every traditional style RC model boat has it's controls below decks; even the Bearospace boats.

The only failure here was a t'gallant clew coming unhooked: Constellation on the Miles River

Been building and racing 1M-solings and IOM's for over a decade with various winch configurations. Pretty much everyone has abandoned sub-deck winch servos due to recurring failures.

If there's an opportunity to mount your running rigging above deck, it will prove its reliability and ease of maintenance over time.

 

[Senorbob]

As noted; this will be a working-sailing model 1/36th the size of the original. All my labor should net a model with the following dimensions:

1. Beam: 13.5" (34.3cm)
2. Length of the hull: 59" (150cm)
3. Length over the rig: 85-3/4" (218cm)
4. Width over the rig: 36" (92cm) ~ Main yard w/o stuns'l booms.
5. Length on deck: 55" (140cm)
6. Draft: 6.7" (17.02cm) w/o ballast keel

This model will be smaller than Constellation which, in fact, is about the size of United States compared to her.
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The edges of the forms were covered with blue masking tape so the planking wouldn't be glued to them. The point is for the hull to be a shell that's fiber-glassed. A 1/4" plywood keelson/stem/sternpost was inserted, and battens were tacked on at the diagonals to steady everything, and on November 20th, 2011, planking commenced with the sheer-plank and the stern tuck. Planking was 3/16" thick by 3/8" wide white pine. It wasn't properly spiled, but was tapered to no less than half it's width where needed, and stealers placed as required. The garboards were 1-1/2" wide cause I was lazy. Absolutely none of this will be visible through paint and a copper bottom, but I know it's there. My quick and nasty planking of Pride still haunts me today, because despite all the paint ~ I know it's there.
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Each plank was edge-glued to the one before it. As planking continued toward the keel, the rest of the transom was planked. The parts of the stem, keel, and stern post were templated and cut from 1/2" plywood to be installed later. When the hull was closed up, it was removed from the build-board and planking above the sheer-plank was installed.
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The forms were popped out, one-by,one, and the inside sanded, painted with diluted wood glue and sanded again. A couple of forms were tacked back in to hold the hulls shape as I sanded and filled any gaps with Water-Putty. A template was made to transfer details like gunports, wales, moldings, etc to the hull.
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The build table was leveled, then the hull on it leveled port and starboard, and blocked up so the waterline marks fore-n-aft were at the same height from the table. A sharp pencil resting on a block of wood cut to the right length was then used to mark the waterline.
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The inside of the hull was given a couple of coats of polyester resin and about half the form were cut down to the dimensions of frames and epoxied back into the hull to hold it's shape from flattening out. The hull was ready to be fiber-glassed when the weather got warm enough.
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for waterproofing try uv resin sometime.