HMS Alert [1777] 1:48 POF by serikoff. (Two hulls: skeleton and fully rigged)

[AllanKP69]

have questions about multiple wedges in the casing

Definitely a translation issue here Are you speaking of the pins and wedges on each side of the main mast step or the wedges between the masts and partners and filling chocks? If the former, from Steel: to have set of bolt holes bored into the kelson about 9 inches from the step. One forward and one aft, that the stp may be wedged to the rake of the mast at pleasure. The bolts about 1 3/8" diameter. (see left side of photo below)

 

[serikoff]

Definitely a translation issue here Are you speaking of the pins and wedges on each side of the main mast step or the wedges between the masts and partners and filling chocks? If the former, from Steel: to have set of bolt holes bored into the kelson about 9 inches from the step. One forward and one aft, that the stp may be wedged to the rake of the mast at pleasure. The bolts about 1 3/8" diameter. (see left side of photo below)

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No, no. I know what you're talking about. I mean what's in the photo below. There is no illustration of this particular unit. That there were how many wedge-shaped boards in the sheathing.

 

[AllanKP69]

Like the external hull planking I don't think there were ever any wedge shaped pieces in the internal planking. Antscherl shows stealers on the Swan class sloops and the drawings I posted above show that stealers and drop strakes both were used. I just found in Peter Goodwin's The Construction and Fitting of the English Man of War, regarding the internal planking ---> Towards the forward and after ends of the hold the lay of the planks was made to diminish in width so that they could be worked to the curvature formed by the rise of the floors.
If you can see the joints of the floors to the futtocks on the model, this will give a good indication at least at two lines of curvature for the planking, the floors and 1st futtock and alternating floors and 2nd futtocks.

Hope this makes some sense. If my grandfather (from Lviv) who was a wood worker all his life was still around I would ask him to help me describe it in Ukrainian and then we'd have some fun

Allan

 

[serikoff]

Like the external hull planking I don't think there were ever any wedge shaped pieces in the internal planking. Antscherl shows stealers on the Swan class sloops and the drawings I posted above show that stealers and drop strakes both were used. I just found in Peter Goodwin's The Construction and Fitting of the English Man of War, regarding the internal planking ---> Towards the forward and after ends of the hold the lay of the planks was made to diminish in width so that they could be worked to the curvature formed by the rise of the floors.
If you can see the joints of the floors to the futtocks on the model, this will give a good indication at least at two lines of curvature for the planking, the floors and 1st futtock and alternating floors and 2nd futtocks.

Hope this makes some sense. If my grandfather (from Lviv) who was a wood worker all his life was still around I would ask them to help me describe it in Ukrainian and then we'd have some fun

Allan

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Wow, the world is small. Well, regarding the curvature of the boards, we must not forget that the keel is at an angle relative to the waterline and the deck too. Therefore, the curvature of the boards that is now on the hull completely repeats the level of the lower deck... So maybe it was like that. But it doesn't matter anymore, it is as it is. Thank you

 

[Frank48]

The second pair of boards already exists, now we will glue the first pair (those closer to the keel, Limber strike).
And to position the boards in the exact place, I used the stationery clips, plus wood (b - in the photo below). Which corresponds to the distance from the keel to the boards on the Mast step (a - in the photo). By the way, on the Mast step there is a ledge (with - in the photo) that needs to be combined with a chute on the keelson.

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And now, you can glue the boards and just rest against the clips, and they will be glued evenly.

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By the way, the gluing technique is the same. I dot the TiteBond II glue on each frame, except for the most lateral ones. I apply CA gel on the bottom. My wife helps me. While I hold the CA point - it holds the board over the PVA. And as soon as the CA sticks, I hold the place where the PVA was for another 5 minutes and everything is ready. Fixation without devices takes 6-7 minutes and you can work further.

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And here is the finished symmetrical result.

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And after that I glued the Mast step.

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Next in line is the third pair of powerboards. Anatomically, this is most likely Upper strike of thickstuff footwaling, but the thickness and width of the board from the set are combinations of the aforementioned and Thickstuff over first futtock heads. (whatever that means)))

It is better to adjust them also from the front.

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We still remember that the board is spinning in a spiral and you need to make a bevel in order to press it like this without a gap. And the joint hit as in the photo.

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But you need to take into account a very vague moment. The ket includes a positioner (part CL 46).
It is necessary that this part passes between the 22th and 23th frames and gets into the groove for the 3rd beam of the lower holly. That is, you need to adjust the board in front so that this happens!

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Well, at the back, similarly, we also cut off until we connect with the second pair of power boards. again, not forgetting the bevel.

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By the way, before that I glued boards without heating, water, steam or iron. But in this situation, the boards go on a screw and it is difficult to keep such tension for a long time. Therefore, at first I gave the boards the correct shape.

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Only the ends of the boards were dipped in boiling water for a minute and immediately hot irons along the plane, I twisted the board with a screw and bent it a little. But you need not overdo it, otherwise you can break it. Then you definitely need to walk with sandpaper, because lint rises from the water.

The fixing method is still the same. Point PVA for each frame and CA at the edges. I press the edges while the spouse helps to hold the middle part, and then I still hold it for 5 minutes and you're done. There are no leaks from the glue, and everything is held flawlessly. And here's the result.

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Looking like lemon slices, or carom, or melon... well, in short, something edible resembles

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Next in line are Breast hooks and the top pair of powerboards - Beam shelf\Deck clamp (which, in fact, most likely go as one board).

Don't switch!

Hi, I ask, ( I don't remember if I asked already)shouldn't the pieces be nailed down? Frank

 

[GIG1810]

Hey Serikoff,

very nice presentation of your project and very nice detailed presentation of your construction progress. I am interested in your beautiful build and will follow your progress and the beautiful pictures with excitement.

Cheers
Günther

 

[serikoff]

Hi, I ask, ( I don't remember if I asked already)shouldn't the pieces be nailed down? Frank

View attachment 521872

Yes, they should. But I will make imitation bolts, but later, when I sand the outer surface.

Hey Serikoff,

very nice presentation of your project and very nice detailed presentation of your construction progress. I am interested in your beautiful build and will follow your progress and the beautiful pictures with excitement.

Cheers
Günther

Thank you very much. I am glad that you are interested. It will be even more interesting.

 

[serikoff]

Thanks to everyone who is interested and follows my building. Thanks for your reaction and comments...

Today there will be two parts at once. 1/2

And in addition to the last post I will add.



Since there is not much glue on single frames, there is a risk that the frame may come off during grinding. Therefore, I pasted a single frame with very liquid CA.

The technique is simple. It is necessary to use a special thin spout and apply glue to the corner between the parts so that the glue penetrates capillary between the parts and thus glues them together when solidified. To speed up the process, an aerosol activator for the CA adhesive can be used.



I worked neatly, but specifically applied a lot in one place to show that the glue can be easily removed with a scalpel and fine sandpaper. And when applying oil - it will not be visible at all that there was once glue.

Glue elimination technique. It is necessary to scrape the remains of the glue with the plane of a straight scalpel. Final polishing with sandpaper. And here's the result. As nothing happened.



It is better to apply very little, but twice than once but a lot and pour everything around.

So, we continue. Next up is the top belt, which will hold the main deck beams. First you need to prepare the blanks...



Then I made a template from a thin rail and bent it along the profile of a real workpiece.



This is necessary in order to understand whether all 3 glued parts will fit into their prepared place.





And most importantly, it was necessary to check whether the board was becoming correct and whether the slots of the positioner coincided.



It is necessary that the CL47 template falls between the 22m and 23m frames and fits into the groove of the power board. I will check this again with real details.

You also need not to forget about the checkpoints. Behind...



The part should become so that it is 2 mm before the beam.



This is the thickness of part 80 (EL or DL in the typo instruction).

And in front you need to make a wedge so that the part fits into place correctly.



Then I glued all the 3 parts of each CA board with gel on a flat isolated plane...



... and polished the surfaces.



* in a couple of minutes - there will be a continuation...

 

[serikoff]

* continue... 2/2

Then, so that the boards do not crack - you had to soak them in boiling water for 15 minutes (maybe I don't remember anymore).



I used a stove top. And it is important that the glue does not spread from the temperature and bending - I clamped the place where the joint was clamped. (one point - isolate the clamps with something, otherwise traces in the water from the metal on the tree may remain!).

Then I removed the excess water and placed the parts in the case, bending very carefully, resting the files on the part for primary stabilization.






Then I fixed in several places at equal intervals with plastic clips (ties).



Outside, they held onto wedge-shaped wooden blocks. If you move the bar from the thin to the thick side, you can control the degree of tension on the screed.



Forgot to mention!!! This is all we do WITHOUT GLUE!!! And that's why!

According to the CL47 positioner, the beams should stand in a certain way and I saw that the board was shifted 1 mm backward. And I understood that it could (and should) be so, because I cut 1 mm of the board in front in place...



Loosened all clamps and moved the board forward by 1 mm.



And now the template CL47 pass between the 22th and 23th frames and passes into the groove for the 4th beam.



Which is the right position. And if I glued it right away, I would not be able to shift the board. But how now to glue what is already right and you can't move it. The answer is simple - capillary gluing.



As I wrote above. You need very liquid CA (very). And a special spout. We apply a small amount to please between the parts (it is better twice a little more than once, but with an excess).



Then, to speed up other things, you can use the activator.

After that, you need to polish the part, remove the rest of the glue and the raised pile from the water.



And almost everything is perfectly clean. It was possible to remove all the surpluses, since there will be two levels of parts on top - they will completely cover all this. But if there was an open place - I would not pour glue so much, and cleaned better, but here it is useless.



As a result, one side is completely ready. It will only remain on the other side.
And here is the result of the work.

 

[serikoff]

Well... I can say that I'm done with the bases. I removed all the auxiliary holders in the slipway and now I can take the ship out with the outside facing up. Well, for now, here's the result of the work up to this point.

There are 518 parts on board and 57 days of pleasant work on the hobby... let's move on!

 

[Dubz Modelling World]

Thanks for the great buildlog! Will be very helpful for me
Dirk

 

[GIG1810]

Hey Serikoff,
very nice work! May I ask how much time you spend taking care of your model? Also, you write a great build report! I'm really looking forward to your pictures and progress.

Cheers
Günther

 

[AllanKP69]

Next up is the top belt, which will hold the main deck beams.

For the Alert the clamps (top belt) would be about 3.5 thick at the top edge and 2.5" at the lower edge. Maybe too much detail for something that will not be seen, but the score that you show in the clamp looks excessive. From (Goodwin, The Construction of the English Man of War, page 66) if the clamp was scored, it would only be about 1 inch, (0.42mm at 1:48) Then again if the beams you have are thicker than what was on the ship the score would have to be deeper than what was actually done to compensate. The upper deck beams on the actual ship would have been moulded about 6.5 to 7 inches (3.4mm to 3.7mm). The drawing of Alert at RMG shows them to be moulded 7" and sided about 10.5" I am curious to know if these are the same as those in the kit.
Allan

 

[serikoff]

Thanks for the great buildlog! Will be very helpful for me
Dirk

Thank you. I was glad to help.

Hey Serikoff,
very nice work! May I ask how much time you spend taking care of your model? Also, you write a great build report! I'm really looking forward to your pictures and progress.

Cheers
Günther

Thank you for your feedback and question. We are currently at war in our country, so I spend all my free time except work on the ship. Since I cannot leave the city, my favorite activity (travel) is currently unavailable to me. Therefore, I spend at least 4-5 hours making the ship almost every day. I can make the ship all day 3 days a week. This is a great alternative to not go crazy from what is happening here. But I hope for the best.

For the Alert the clamps (top belt) would be about 3.5 thick at the top edge and 2.5" at the lower edge. Maybe too much detail for something that will not be seen, but the score that you show in the clamp looks excessive. From (Goodwin, The Construction of the English Man of War, page 66) if the clamp was scored, it would only be about 1 inch, (0.42mm at 1:48) Then again if the beams you have are thicker than what was on the ship the score would have to be deeper than what was actually done to compensate. The upper deck beams on the actual ship would have been moulded about 6.5 to 7 inches (3.4mm to 3.7mm). The drawing of Alert at RMG shows them to be moulded 7" and sided about 10.5" I am curious to know if these are the same as those in the kit.
Allan

Unfortunately, when it comes to terms, the translator translates something incomprehensible. I'm afraid I'll answer incorrectly. Let's do it this way: when I get to the decks, I'll take all the dimensions of the parts of this unit and post them in the description. I hope this will answer your question.

 

[serikoff]

Not minutes of rest, we rush on...

This is why this part does not need to be glued and it is advisable to cut it (as I previously showed it all in the review). Because when removing the ship - these parts are easier to remove. We won't need them anymore.



Voila... and the hull is free!

By the way, it is in this form (only without a keel) that it will soon be scanned. I will tell you everything in more detail, but you will remember this picture...



How cool he is after all... The body looks cool in the hand, I really like it... and that's before grinding!





The manufacturer thought out the slipway very well. If you turn over the lid with the model and insert its top with your feet, you can snap the lid with the same clips so that it sits firmly in its place.





And in this form, you can safely grind the case. A little tip: so that the slipway does not drive around the table - it can be fixed with clothespins or clamps.





I could admire this view for a long time, but we continue.

At first, I cut the edges of the frames along the line of the bottom board with a straight blade so that they were one arc, and not different lengths.



At the back - there is a template and you can do it using it. And in other places this arc goes along the edge (chamfer) that we did on the false keel.



Protectionism is my middle name.



Well, let's go over the grinding technique. It is almost the same as inside, but there are differences.

In the front and back, you need to alternate between a hard straight, cylindrical and soft sandpaper base depending on the surface. And to speed up the process, change the sandpaper often.









And in the main central part you need a rigid base (wooden beam).



And in places where it is difficult to get to, I put sandpaper several times.



I made a temporary keel not only in order to remove it before scanning, but it also eliminates the risk of damage to a real keel during the grinding process, especially if the grain is large.
And by the way, about abrasiveness. I use cloth-based sandpaper first grain 80, then 150 and then 240. Or 120 and then 240. Locally some zone can refine 320, but only locally (to remove micro-scratches) where can not get well 240. That's all for now... I think that for 2 days I will grind it and after - I will show the result. Don't switch))





P.S. in the photo from above - the hull even before grinding.

...

 

[Peter Voogt]

Not minutes of rest, we rush on...

This is why this part does not need to be glued and it is advisable to cut it (as I previously showed it all in the review). Because when removing the ship - these parts are easier to remove. We won't need them anymore.

View attachment 522206

Voila... and the hull is free!

By the way, it is in this form (only without a keel) that it will soon be scanned. I will tell you everything in more detail, but you will remember this picture...

View attachment 522207

How cool he is after all... The body looks cool in the hand, I really like it... and that's before grinding!

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The manufacturer thought out the slipway very well. If you turn over the lid with the model and insert its top with your feet, you can snap the lid with the same clips so that it sits firmly in its place.

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And in this form, you can safely grind the case. A little tip: so that the slipway does not drive around the table - it can be fixed with clothespins or clamps.

View attachment 522227

I could admire this view for a long time, but we continue.

At first, I cut the edges of the frames along the line of the bottom board with a straight blade so that they were one arc, and not different lengths.

View attachment 522217

At the back - there is a template and you can do it using it. And in other places this arc goes along the edge (chamfer) that we did on the false keel.

View attachment 522218

Protectionism is my middle name.

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Well, let's go over the grinding technique. It is almost the same as inside, but there are differences.

The front and back of the case need to be polished with soft-base sandpaper (insulation for pipes is suitable) as there are concave places.

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And in the main central part you need a rigid base (wooden beam).

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And in places where it is difficult to get to, I put sandpaper several times.

View attachment 522223

I made a temporary keel not only in order to remove it before scanning, but it also eliminates the risk of damage to a real keel during the grinding process, especially if the grain is large.
And by the way, about abrasiveness. I use cloth-based sandpaper first grain 80, then 150 and then 240. Or 120 and then 240. Locally some zone can refine 320, but only locally (to remove micro-scratches) where can not get well 240. That's all for now... I think that for 2 days I will grind it and after - I will show the result. Don't switch))

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P.S. in the photo from above - the hull even before grinding.

...

Congratulations with this milestone, Sergey: free op the jig. Now she shows het beautiful lines.
Regards, Peter

 

[kuba91nt]

Grade 80 on soft hull For me, anything below 150 is a cheese grater

 

[serikoff]

Congratulations with this milestone, Sergey: free op the jig. Now she shows het beautiful lines.
Regards, Peter

I already want to see the ship's hull in a polished form as soon as possible.

Grade 80 on soft hull For me, anything below 150 is a cheese grater

Cherry is a very dense wood, so the most protruding parts can be 80t, otherwise it can all drag on for a long time. If after that you go through 120 and then 240 everything will be like glass. I can already see the result, it's been tested.

 

[serikoff]

For the second day, I, like dad Carlo, have been planing my Pinocchio and have not finished yet.

I think tomorrow it will be ready and you need to try to scan the case on Friday. In the meantime, some useful moments for those who will be assembling this ship. (but this also applies to other POF).



The first point is the insulation of finishing places from coarse sandpaper. (I was too lazy to do it right away and accidentally scratched a little, do not repeat my mistakes).

Then, after rough grinding with grain 80 and 120, I removed the temporary keel.

* By the way, to the remark that 80 and 120 are a lot for a soft case... so, do not forget that this is cherries. She is very tough and tight. When I passed with grain 150, almost everything stood still, but with 80 things went faster.



Now there is access to those places where this keel prevented us.



Plus, the view has become better and from this better polishing control.



After passing grain 150 and up to 240, I decided to check the level of grinding.

When I made frames, I lengthened the grinding place by 5 mm, but I still took a conductor that shows where the body cut lines will be...



... and after putting it to the body - applied the lines.



And from them you can immediately determine the place that I polished above the cut or not.



And in some places I raised the level of grinding a little bit.



Tomorrow, if everything goes well, I will post the result of grinding and polishing the case. I already see that he is just awesome, but you need to finish something...

UPD: Another life hack for finding flaws that you can usually miss. A flashlight helps a lot with this!


...

 

[serikoff]

So, can you congratulate me, I finished grinding the hull.

It took 3 days. But the result more than rules me!

I thought difficulties would be ahead (due to moments with 2nd and 3rd frames), but in fact I spent the whole day tinkering with only one stern.

Before coating the oil, I will still check everything with a microscope, but at the moment - everything is smooth, smooth and, most importantly, symmetrical!

1/2



























Follow up in next post...