Le Saint Philippe 1693 after Jean-Claude Lemineur (Ancre) in scale 1:48

[dockattner]

Hello Friends!

After a bit of an internal struggle as to whether or not I wanted to create another build report, here I am back in a familiar spot (but on an unfamiliar side of the forum).

One of my particular flaws is I don’t like to do the same thing twice. My first ship model was a plank-on-bulkhead adaptation of the DeAgostini Vasa. Next, I was privileged to get my hands on the discontinued Lauck Street Shipyard plank-on-frame Kingfisher. If you are familiar with those build reports, you know I am very comfortable modifying/replacing/adding to the kit parts to make the model my very own – scratch building felt like a natural extension.

So that’s one fully rigged 17th century galleon, and one unrigged 18th century swan class admiralty model. Each of these are prominently displayed in my house and are summarily ignored by most everyone who enters . Good thing I build for the enjoyment of the process rather than the response I get to the final product .

This current project will be a stern section model of the French warship Saint Philippe – primarily in European pearwood. It will be fully finished on the exterior – and left in frames on the interior (that is, there will not be any planking or build-out on the open interior of the hull).

FAQ

Why a stern section model rather than the whole ship?

Several thoughts come to mind here. First, the entire ship is beyond my current level of experience and knowledge. Mr. Lemineur’s monograph is famously difficult to interpret. Michele Padoan is currently building this ship, and we all know that I am no Michele Padoan. Nigel Brook has started this model in 1:36 but has set it aside in favor of other projects (and we all know that I am no NMBrook). Concurrent with the development of the monograph two builders also completed this ship and a few photographs of those models accompany the monograph but there are no construction diaries. I am unaware of anyone else successfully completing the Saint Philippe in POF (though I am not on many international forums).

Second, I am not really wanting to take on an 8 to10 year project right now. There are other ships I want to build if God allows me to linger…


Why a stern section of the Saint Philippe?

This is a beautiful ship. As a flag-carrying vessel of King Louis XIV she sits alongside the Royal Louis and the Soleil Royal as representative of a special time in French ship-building history. The ornate stern will require my best work and the challenge appeals to me.


Why not simply build plank-on-bulkhead and finish out the interior?

I believe there is much to be gained by forcing myself to learn how to read plans and fabricate parts from scratch. Surely the experience will make future projects more approachable.


Why build to 1:48 scale?

In one sense, a 1:36 presentation would allow me to get the most out of the stern décor. At 1:48 there will be some compromises. But even at 1:48 this is still a fairly large model, and the space necessary to display it is a factor to be considered. Plus, the Kingfisher was built to 1:48 and I think this will be an effective comparison of relative ship size.

To be continued...

 

[dockattner]

As I mentioned a moment ago, I was in a weird place where I was not going to post a build report. The reasons are complicated – but basically, I was finding myself annoyed by several individuals (a small group?) on the forum. Self-righteousness is always unattractive in my book, so I found the forum draining rather than life-giving.

On the other hand – there are some truly remarkable fellow modelers on the forum, so I’ll do my best to lean into those friends rather than allowing the others to take the joy out of my participation.

All this to say that the model has been on my workbench for a while now and I have not been diligent in taking pictures. The smattering that I have will have to suffice.

The Ancre monograph is epic in its breadth. But for those familiar with it you will understand it when I say that there are some difficulties. Perhaps the single most vexing is that Mr. Lemineur argues that the frames were not perpendicular to the keel – they tip ‘forward’ about 1.2 or 1.3 degrees. As you might expect, that makes the drawings uncharacteristically difficult to interpret.

At first I thought to simply ignore this feature – but eventually I decided that would be unwise. The construction solution is rather simple – but every time I look at a drawing it gives me a headache.

The one significant departure that I am taking (sorry @NMBROOK) is the way the frame pairs are joined. The Saint Philippe has morticed frames. Here are a few images from Nigel's build showing what I am talking about:




The purpose of these mortices was to lessen the tendency of the ship to hog (the bow and stern are less buoyant by volume, so they sag into the water).

I have chosen to ignore this distinctive feature of the SP. You might argue that omitting the mortices is tantamount to no longer building Le Saint Philippe. But I am fully planking the exterior so the mortices would not even be visible there. The interior of the framing WILL be visible – but is the added complication of morticed frame pairs justified for the little bit it would be visible on the inside of the hull? I have decided it would not be. My apologies to the historical purists.


In true scratch building form, I began with rough cut lumber. This is European pearwood purchased at great cost :



After some head-scratching I figured out how to use some of my shop tools to turn these into dimensional billets:



I chose to begin with the frames. For this stern section model I decided to build 15 frame pairs (30 single frames) in the typical manner. You know how it goes:











Here is the size of an SP frame compared to the Kingfisher (both are 1:48 scale):





The obligatory picture of a stack of rough frames:





For the Kingfisher I installed these frames in a build jig and commenced with the sanding/shaping. Here I chose to add some provisional bevels based on the frame drawings. I left some extra on the frames, but I won’t know if I left enough until it comes time for the final shaping...

The Kattner sanding center:





My thanks for your interest!

 

[Jimsky]

I'm really glad you decided to share this build; I’ll be watching it with high interest. Your thoughtful approach, willingness to challenge yourself, and the choice of subject all make this a compelling project from the start. The Saint Philippe’s stern is indeed a masterpiece of naval art, and I look forward to seeing how you bring it to life.

Wishing you an enjoyable and rewarding build journey, mon ami!

 

[Peter Voogt]

I fully agree with Jim! You made the right decision to start a new build-log, Paul. Besides of showing your steps and progress to us, it’s also a good item to keep yourself sharp and on track. Via the pictures of making the log, you test yourself by seeing and reading what you have done after interpretation the drawings.
I suppose Jim took a chair? Hopefully there is one for me.
The start is very promising. And your choices for 1:48 and scratch from reading plans ……. It couldn’t be better!
Regards, Peter

 

[CLB]

Wow Paul - kudos for you for picking probably the toughest Ancre Monograph by one of the most challenging authors. Ill be following and cheering you on !
Chris

 

[CLB]

BTW if you get serious with this type of construction you may want to upgrade your mill to make your life easier than with the Proxxon. I picked up my TAIG for under 900. They had many of the manual mills in stock reconditioned for trade ins by those exchanging them for CNC models. I chose TAIG per Jim Byrnes reco. It has a longer bed and is already equipped with the stepper motor to turn at 10000 RPM needed for hardwoods. You have to by that add on with Sherline. I do use many of the Sherline accessories though.

 

[Jimsky]

I suppose Jim took a chair?

Naturally, Peter, not only did I take a chair, but knowing Paul's build logs tend to pack the house, we went ahead and brought in an extra 1,000 chairs. Standing room just won’t do this time. 's on standby too!

 

[dockattner]

I'm really glad you decided to share this build; I’ll be watching it with high interest. Your thoughtful approach, willingness to challenge yourself, and the choice of subject all make this a compelling project from the start. The Saint Philippe’s stern is indeed a masterpiece of naval art, and I look forward to seeing how you bring it to life.

Wishing you an enjoyable and rewarding build journey, mon ami!

Thanks, Jim. Of course, the very day I decided to post a build report all he## broke loose on another thread and I instantly regretted spending even one more minute of my life hanging around with the chronically insufferable...

I fully agree with Jim! You made the right decision to start a new build-log, Paul. Besides of showing your steps and progress to us, it’s also a good item to keep yourself sharp and on track. Via the pictures of making the log, you test yourself by seeing and reading what you have done after interpretation the drawings.
I suppose Jim took a chair? Hopefully there is one for me.
The start is very promising. And your choices for 1:48 and scratch from reading plans ……. It couldn’t be better!
Regards, Peter

These are wise words, Peter. A build report does force us to be more observant of our work. Plus, I really do find the interaction with the majority of our members a real delight (notwithstanding what I just wrote to Jim).

Wow Paul - kudos for you for picking probably the toughest Ancre Monograph by one of the most challenging authors. Ill be following and cheering you on !
Chris

Thanks, Chris. Truth be told - I almost brought the monograph to your house today to get your take on some of the drawings .

BTW if you get serious with this type of construction you may want to upgrade your mill to make your life easier than with the Proxxon. I picked up my TAIG for under 900. They had many of the manual mills in stock reconditioned for trade ins by those exchanging them for CNC models. I chose TAIG per Jim Byrnes reco. It has a longer bed and is already equipped with the stepper motor to turn at 10000 RPM needed for hardwoods. You have to by that add on with Sherline. I do use many of the Sherline accessories though.

Good words. I struggled today just cutting notches in the keel (well, I guess, the aft deadwood) for the frames. I tweaked the Proxxon mill by installing thrust bearings on the X - Y table but haven't done that yet on the Z-axis. I did install a caliper to help but I sure could have used digital readouts on all three axes.

I'm decidedly out of my depth when it comes to power tools. When all the real men were taking shop classes in school or learning the man-arts I was dissecting frogs, learning about the Krebs Cycle, and memorizing muscle innervations... Everything I know about mitochondria and moments of rotation in orthodontics gets me nowhere in this hobby.

 

[NMBROOK]

Brilliant Paul!
I fully understand skipping the mortices, a LOT of additional work not necessarily justified if you are planking.
Aside from the carving, there are challenges in the finer framing of the quarter galleries not helped by rather “sketchy” detail of this in the monograph

I will return to my build in due course, from the outset it was set out as a slow burn in the background until I reach retirement.

You have made a good start as always and I shall be following along. Don’t hesitate to ask if you have difficulty interpreting the drawings

 

[Namabiiru]

Paul, so glad you've opted for the build log. There's always the ignore button for those who suck the fun out of it.

By the way, your lawn is as beautiful as your ship-building.

 

[CLB]

Paul believe me as you've seen I dont mind re doing assemblies, but after spending all afternoon milling an assembly to see the Proxxon skip due to its toy like workings - I wanted to chuck it out the window. As you're finding out, these builds are frustrating enough without tools adding to it...

Look forward to seeing your next update.

 

[dockattner]

Brilliant Paul!
I fully understand skipping the mortices, a LOT of additional work not necessarily justified if you are planking.
Aside from the carving, there are challenges in the finer framing of the quarter galleries not helped by rather “sketchy” detail of this in the monograph

I will return to my build in due course, from the outset it was set out as a slow burn in the background until I reach retirement.

You have made a good start as always and I shall be following along. Don’t hesitate to ask if you have difficulty interpreting the drawings

Thanks, Nigel. I see many challenges on the horizon. My current plan is to abandon the build during the attempted fabrication of the fashion pieces...

Paul, so glad you've opted for the build log. There's always the ignore button for those who suck the fun out of it.

By the way, your lawn is as beautiful as your ship-building.

Thanks for the encouragement. I'm not sure what the 'ignore' button does but I have just employed it .

EDIT: the IGNORE button is brilliant! What a lovely solution.

 

[NMBROOK]

Paul, now I know you are joking you won’t let it beat you!

I will research the ignore button, I have found a use for it

 

[campos]

Estivador, acompanhado com interesse. Belo centro de lixamento.

 

[Maarten]

Hi Paul, good to see you back in the build of a full scratch, and what a build it is with a lovely amount of carving. I think I know what you will be doing during your trip on the Danube .

Ps you mentioned the frames are leaning 1,2 deg forward. Maybe this has to do with the fact that the draft on the rear is more than at the bow? In Dutch we call this " Stuurlast" and the frames are 90 deg to the waterline.
You could consider to have the frames at a 90 deg angle from the measuring surface and put the keel under and angle while building the ship.
Draw the same meaduring surface on the drawing and you solve the problem.

Hope it helps.

 

[RogerD]

Hi Paul, I was very pleased to read the start of this, your new thread and build. I am extremely interested in the type of vessel you have chosen and look forward to joining the other SoS members in following along.

Given the familiar congenial nature of this forum your log will help provide some rebalance to the joy of this hobby as opposed to recent unnecessary distractions.

 

[dockattner]

Estivador, acompanhado com interesse. Belo centro de lixamento.

Thank you, Campos. Yes, the view helps make the tedium of sanding rather pleasant.

Hi Paul, I was very pleased to read the start of this, your new thread and build. I am extremely interested in the type of vessel you have chosen and look forward to joining the other SoS members in following along.

Given the familiar congenial nature of this forum your log will help provide some rebalance to the joy of this hobby as opposed to recent unnecessary distractions.

Much appreciated, Roger. Let's see what comes of this new effort.

 

[dockattner]

Hi Paul, good to see you back in the build of a full scratch, and what a build it is with a lovely amount of carving. I think I know what you will be doing during your trip on the Danube .

Ps you mentioned the frames are leaning 1,2 deg forward. Maybe this has to do with the fact that the draft on the rear is more than at the bow? In Dutch we call this " Stuurlast" and the frames are 90 deg to the waterline.
You could consider to have the frames at a 90 deg angle from the measuring surface and put the keel under and angle while building the ship.
Draw the same meaduring surface on the drawing and you solve the problem.

Hope it helps.

Well, you may be on to something, Maarten. The stern of the ship does indeed sit deeper in the water than the bow (the waterline does not parallel the keel just as you anticipated). But when I measure the frames relative to the waterline now they tip backward...perhaps even a bit more than they tip forward relative to the keel.

As for the building solution...now both you and Nigel have suggested the very same remedy. Consider it done .

 

[AllanKP69]

The Kattner sanding center:

How on earth can you get any modeling work, or any work for that matter, done in such a beautiful setting? A book and a good music playlist with some Pavorotti and Boccelli would be my druthers in such a setting.
Allan