Here is a photo.
Hi Rick,
The kit you show is the totaly reworked deagostini kit, it is posted on the Wertringer modellbau forum. We have a post on that model here also by Nigel @NMBROOK with some fantastic work.
Sovereign of the Seas-Deagostini Partwork-1/84 TOTALLY Reworked
Hello Everyone Firstly,a few of the longer standing members will remember this log before the crash.Unfortuneately my images were lost when my laptop harddrive fried so I was unable to repair the log. I am going to attempt to present a sequence of pictures that show the best I can,the progress...
shipsofscale.com
The reason for moving the bowsprit is correct. The older ships had a stem with a far less gradient angle, the fwd wast was more to the front leaving less space for fixing the bow sprit. The bow sprit was attached along side the fwd mast and there for off centre. However the tip of the bow sprit was in line with the other masts.
See below this bow sprit passing by along the stem and not on top of the stem as in English ships later in the 17yh century. This is a contempory van de Velde drawing of the ship, you clearly see a lion carving on top of the stem with the bow sprit passing behind it.
- Joined
- Aug 16, 2019
- Messages
- 870
- Points
- 343
There are 6 majors ships that I just love
Not in order the Wasa, Soleil Royal, Sovereing of the Seas, the Berlin, Royal Louis and the Santisima Trinidad
So be certain that I will follow your build
Not in order the Wasa, Soleil Royal, Sovereing of the Seas, the Berlin, Royal Louis and the Santisima Trinidad
So be certain that I will follow your build
Thank you for your input.
Rick
Thank you for the detailed explanation Maarten. 
I really love the drawing of van de Velde. There you see that the kit is only halfway accurate. But I have to admit that I am building my Sovereign more for looks than to make a historical accurate model.
By the way I also made a small progress. I continued with the railing on the bow castle and also added some decoration to the bow area. There you also see on of my problems. The bow is to small to fit two rows of decoration. So I decided to stay with one (picture will be uploaded when I have finished it). I know it is not historically correct, but as I have written before if I have to choose I go for the look. Hope you understand my decision.
I really love the drawing of van de Velde. There you see that the kit is only halfway accurate. But I have to admit that I am building my Sovereign more for looks than to make a historical accurate model.
By the way I also made a small progress. I continued with the railing on the bow castle and also added some decoration to the bow area. There you also see on of my problems. The bow is to small to fit two rows of decoration. So I decided to stay with one (picture will be uploaded when I have finished it). I know it is not historically correct, but as I have written before if I have to choose I go for the look. Hope you understand my decision.
I will admit, that now knowing this about the Bow Sprint. I will more than likely as another pointed out go with the way the kit shows. I am afraid I would bugger it up if I strayed away. I do not have the skills like you guys and it was something that caught my attention. As always, all one has to do is ask and they will answer. I should be receiving my 2nd pack soon. I am excited to build this beast. She is one of my favorite vessels.
Rick
Rick
So you be the fella that took this kit to a whole different level. I spent 8 years in Germany and do speak or I will say tried to speak the language. Enough to order a beer anyway. I saved your build log from the German Forum and have looked at the photos repeatedly to glean from your mad skills. Now that I know you are here, I will follow along.Thank you for the detailed explanation Maarten.
I really love the drawing of van de Velde. There you see that the kit is only halfway accurate. But I have to admit that I am building my Sovereign more for looks than to make a historical accurate model.
By the way I also made a small progress. I continued with the railing on the bow castle and also added some decoration to the bow area. There you also see on of my problems. The bow is to small to fit two rows of decoration. So I decided to stay with one (picture will be uploaded when I have finished it). I know it is not historically correct, but as I have written before if I have to choose I go for the look. Hope you understand my decision.
View attachment 108133
Rick
Hi Wolfgang
The bowsprit discussion is something that was covered a few years ago now on a forum I was a member of when I started my build.Basically it was decided that the offset bowsprit design was the only feasible option given the proximity to the foremast which is further forward than later vessels in relation to the foremast.The only way for a solid anchor for the bowsprit was to run this along side and past the foremast.However the foremost tip of the bowsprit would still fall on the centreline of the ship.
This detail also featured on Revenge if memory serves me right.
This is by no means a criticism of your build and I defy anyone to make a historically accurate model of this vessel.Two years of research have been expended on my model and still there are many grey areas and many areas open to builders interpretation.
Bottom line is build what makes you happy,either path you follow,Sovereign can build into a stunning model.
Kind Regards
Nigel
The bowsprit discussion is something that was covered a few years ago now on a forum I was a member of when I started my build.Basically it was decided that the offset bowsprit design was the only feasible option given the proximity to the foremast which is further forward than later vessels in relation to the foremast.The only way for a solid anchor for the bowsprit was to run this along side and past the foremast.However the foremost tip of the bowsprit would still fall on the centreline of the ship.
This detail also featured on Revenge if memory serves me right.
This is by no means a criticism of your build and I defy anyone to make a historically accurate model of this vessel.Two years of research have been expended on my model and still there are many grey areas and many areas open to builders interpretation.
Bottom line is build what makes you happy,either path you follow,Sovereign can build into a stunning model.
Kind Regards
Nigel
On NMM there are some interesting downloads available. Take a look at the Book review of Busmann book, where I added the information:
Book review - Book Review: "SOVEREIGN OF THE SEAS - Die Skulpturen des britischen Königsschiffes von 1637" by Hendrik Busmann
Book Review: SOVEREIGN OF THE SEAS - Die Skulpturen des britischen Königsschiffes von 1637 by Hendrik Busmann Gebundene Ausgabe: 311 Seiten Verlag: CONVENT Hamburg (2002) Sprache: Deutsch ISBN-10: 3934613195 ISBN-13: 978-3934613195 Verpackungsabmessungen: 27,4 x 21,5 x 3 cm / 1.580...
shipsofscale.com
Hello all,
ran into some issues and it took me long to solve and also partly destruction of the bow section, just to rebuild it exactly the same way as it was. The reason for all this was that the decoraction of the bow was not fitting on the bow I built. So I destroyed part of it and tried to use the pre-cut part from the build which is not fitting at all. So I took the heavy decision to leave some decoration in the box. Even historically not correct put less decoration on the bow, but I like it as it is.
ran into some issues and it took me long to solve and also partly destruction of the bow section, just to rebuild it exactly the same way as it was. The reason for all this was that the decoraction of the bow was not fitting on the bow I built. So I destroyed part of it and tried to use the pre-cut part from the build which is not fitting at all. So I took the heavy decision to leave some decoration in the box. Even historically not correct put less decoration on the bow, but I like it as it is.
I have continued with the railings. As you see I used some left over parts to secure the pillars during the painting. I put them in there upside down. After the paint was dry I glued them in place. Additionally I used some gold paint to highlight the base plate for all the pillars.
Next step is to paint the top part of the pillars black and add the wooden strips to complete the railing. The strips will be oiled and not painted.
Next step is to paint the top part of the pillars black and add the wooden strips to complete the railing. The strips will be oiled and not painted.
Hi,
I made my SoS the pretty much the same way what Nigel explained, except the keel does not protrude beyond the floor. The other difference is that I made the tip of the bowsprit overshooting the centerline so that the position where the bowsprit sail is attached is approximately at the centreline of the ship.
And she is a bit dusty because I have not touched her for quite a few months now.
Janos
Sorry to hijack your log, Wolfgang. Your build is beautiful!
Hello Janos,
exchanging information is what makes this forum so great. I love your build of the SoS. There is only oe word for your carvings: awesome.
Before starting my build I decided that I make my bowsprit centered as proposed by Mantua. Changing the way it should be would be difficult now, because there is no support for the bowsprit in inside the hull.
exchanging information is what makes this forum so great. I love your build of the SoS. There is only oe word for your carvings: awesome.
Before starting my build I decided that I make my bowsprit centered as proposed by Mantua. Changing the way it should be would be difficult now, because there is no support for the bowsprit in inside the hull.
Danke, Wolfgang!
I am not saying that mine is right or yours is wrong, far from it! Just showing the way I was doing it.
Already a few month passed since I was doing anything on SoS but hopefully I would be able to finish Oliver Cromwell soon so I can come back to SoS.
Best regards
Janos
I am not saying that mine is right or yours is wrong, far from it! Just showing the way I was doing it.
Already a few month passed since I was doing anything on SoS but hopefully I would be able to finish Oliver Cromwell soon so I can come back to SoS.
Best regards
Janos
Looking very good!
wolfgang,
Just found your log - will follow as well. Beautifully executed work!! - your black offsetting the gold gilded parts is striking.
SOS has always been on my "wish list" not sure that I can do her the proper justice however.
PS: Yes Janos' work is in the 1% -
PS2: Did you consider the deAgostini example? only asking because your Mantua looks to be very high quality. Mantua can be found at some discounted prices during sales.
Regards,
Just found your log - will follow as well. Beautifully executed work!! - your black offsetting the gold gilded parts is striking.
SOS has always been on my "wish list" not sure that I can do her the proper justice however.
PS: Yes Janos' work is in the 1% -
PS2: Did you consider the deAgostini example? only asking because your Mantua looks to be very high quality. Mantua can be found at some discounted prices during sales.
Regards,
Hello Michael,
Thank you ver much for you kind words. To be honest I have taken the colour scheme from GaryM's SoS.
I did consider the SoS from DeAgostini as well, but I got a good offer on the Mantua SoS.
During the weekend I was able to continue with the starboard decorations. Additionally I added another 2 cannons.
Thank you ver much for you kind words. To be honest I have taken the colour scheme from GaryM's SoS.
I did consider the SoS from DeAgostini as well, but I got a good offer on the Mantua SoS.
During the weekend I was able to continue with the starboard decorations. Additionally I added another 2 cannons.