VOC ship The Prins Willem (scale 1:75) Year 1651

[kirill4]

Oh! Thanks!
I didn't noted them ! It iv Very interesting details!....
In this respect Vroom made very accurate picture shown buntline on the top sail on his pictures ... I was suprised why he painted only one buntline,not two... but now it is clear why!
As I understood, sails remain original on the model , not newmade during restoration...
Thanks for findings!

 

[Steef66]

Oh! Thanks!
I didn't noted them ! It iv Very interesting details!....
In this respect Vroom made very accurate picture shown buntline on the top sail on his pictures ... I was suprised why he painted only one buntline,not two... but now it is clear why!
As I understood, sails remain original on the model , not newmade during restoration...
Thanks for findings!

It is also not complete, during the last 400 years there was a lot happening to the model.
And not every rope that was used on the ship, you can find back on this model. But it gives us a lot of information. Herman Ketting should put more information in his book about the rigging.

 

[kirill4]

They, this blocks, could be placed on the sails tie?...
same as sometimes blocks for leechlines attached to the sails tie ... this arrangement of leechline bloks we could see on the Velde pictures I posted early...

 

[kirill4]

Some of people , on thant German forum did like too much what Herman Ketting made with model during restoration... there are interesting discussion about this model...
In the main screem of german forum there is a button to change language ,in the left low corner on the main page ... when switch from german to english it became very comfortable for reading...

 

[Steef66]

They, this blocks, could be placed on the sails tie?.

Good found. That's possible.

Yes its a friendly site to read. But no problem reading or understand German. Grow up along the border of Germany. Writing is difficult.

There is another model of the PW. It is build by the book of Ketting together with Ketting. Ab mentioned early in this thread.

 

[Ab Hoving]

Sorry for my late reply. I was busy working on the replacement of some models I donated to a museum. My house seems empty without at least a fluit and a pinas. The fluit is ready by now and at the moment I am working on a new pinas as described by Witsen (after my own plans )
The matter of leech lines and buntlines is rather academic. I am sure for small ships other rules were applied than for bigger ones. You have to trust your own judgement. On my latest fluit I illustrate how the sail was brought to the yard:



First the clew lines were pulled, next the buntlines. One buntline on each side of the sail, one or two for the lower side (two sheaves on the yard). The crew was sitting on the yard to tie the sail to the yard. One hand for the ship, one for yourself.
To be fair, I often cheat a bit with all the ropes, to prevent chaos and hodge podge at the top. I do mount all the ropes, but I confess, some of them are not belayed where they should.
Better pictures in my own thread, in due time.

 

[Steef66]

Thanks @Ab Hoving your Fluit looks amazing. Exactly what you say about the difference in ships when they're small or big. And using your own judgement. Your crew on your fluit makes sence how this work to tie the sails was done. They need help from below to get these sails up. And indeed when they're big you need more places to get them up. In Harland is this very good illustrated.

One buntline on each side of the sail

I little trouble with understanding your words, here you mean port and starboard?

one or two for the lower side (two sheaves on the yard)

Sheaves for the leechlines I assume. But what is the meaning of one or two for the lower side.

Yes your also right about prevent chaos, less could be more.

 

[Ab Hoving]

I mean two buntlines running from the lower side of the main and fore sail up to the clamp in the middle of the yard, where blocks leads them below (and I often cheat by ending them there ). Sometimes there was just one bunt line, sometimes the line to the side (leech line?) passes an eye in the boltrope and goes on to the lower side of the sail, like in the Hohenzollern model, but they are an exception for as far as I could find.

The two from the sides pass the sheaves on the yard. Just two sheaves. I never saw more, but I'm only referring to Dutch 17-century ships. I'm sure other times and other countries had different methods, as perfectly shown in several pictures in this thread. Use the Van de Velde drawings and paintings as a reliable source and don't rely too much on modern books. They are almost always interpretations. Better go for original sources (and even there is not always consensus), however trustworthy modern publications may look.

 

[Steef66]

Thanks for your help @Ab Hoving , it's all clear now.

I only have to figure out where the blocks of the buntlines will be attached. To the colar, to the yard, to the tie there are a lot of was to do. The books say the same(colar), but the paintings and the model in Amsterdam show indeed something else. It will be a long time before I can start on the sails. Plenty of time to find out.

 

[Steef66]

The yards are ready, And I started with the rigging, First everything on the foot of the masts because after the shrouds it's hard to get there.
The Mizen stay on the Mainmast was the first thing.

 

[Steef66]

There a lot of parts to be attached to the main mast.



These parts should be attached before the mast is put in place. Doing it after the mast is placed, the job is a pain in the @$$. I can tell you.
Not satisfy about the end result, lot of glue and scratches. The brass parts need to be treated and I think a finished layer of Danish Oil will do a miracle.

 

[Maarten]

Very nice thread on this topic Steef. Learned a lot.

 

[mati.n]

Hi Stephan,

Great progres.

...but I have some doubts.
Correct me if I'm wrong.

This is main mast as far I can see...
...then I think you have wrong block for the mizzen shroud.
You should have deadeye here... not five "sheave" block.... I think



Also... are you sure you should have those five "sheave" blocks?
I saw them in De 7 Provincien... but PW should have just 3 sheave blocks for fore and main shroud.
Even in Ketting book you can see them...

I would also increase diameter of block stropping... look's slightly to thin for the size of the block.

Cheers,
Matt

 

[Uwek]

such a deadeye is also shown in the sketch

 

[Steef66]

I think you have wrong block for the mizzen shroud

You're correct. This ship was a present to finish. A lot of work was done by the first owner. The mast where ready incl. All tops, heads and blocks for tie and stay. He made these blocks. And I know that this one should be a deadeye.
I did a lot of change on the ornaments and colours. (The old colours where about 10 years old and not very UV resistant.
There are a lot of things wrong on the mast and tops. Corrections will stay to much visible. After a short think I decide to use the blocks he made. Only the expert would see it. I don"t want to do this last change of work he did.
So forgive me.

 

[Steef66]

such a deadeye is also shown in the sketch

Ai ai now everybody knows )

 

[Steef66]

Thanks for the many likes, comments, good advise and visiting my log

Starting to make a lot of stuff, tiny stuff.

find the starting and endpoint of this grommet?


On the bottom, I cut the both ends exactly against each other and a little drop of glue did the rest.

And now we go for the tackles behind the mizen shrouds.



Next are the shrouds themself.

 

[Steef66]

Thanks for the likes!

The first 2 shroud lines are done
special thanks to @KUDIN and his tutorial

LE FLEURON. 1729. 1\48. KUDIN ANDREY.(YouTube)

Fairy fingers !! Thumbsup

shipsofscale.com

The fist one was a pain in the @$$ specially finding how to knot and how to hold hands to make these tiny wouldings. the deadeye is 3 mm and the rope 0,55, 035 and 0,2 mm.
The second one goes a little bit quicker. By the last one I will be expert in making these things and you can hire me.

 

[Steef66]

Thanks everybody for the likes and visiting my thread

Little update on the smallest mast. The mizen. I made the shrouds and the stay.
and pictures say more than words....



next are the deadeyes on the top to attached them to the shroud below. and then the ratlines. I made a drawing I can put behind the shrouds to keep the straight. I cut a piece out of it to be fit behind the ropes.. (pdf) distance between the ratlines will be 5,3 mm.

thanks for watching and if there are things that are wrong please tell me. (except the deadeye of the stay, I'm aware of that)

 

[Alexander74]

if there are things that are wrong please tell me.

Stefan, great job. Musing for 5 points, like the headquarters itself. I have a question for the guys, I guess the distortion of the photo, but still. As if the guys were wrapped around the sufers in different directions. Marked with arrows