"Flying Cloud " by Mamoli - kit bash

Peter Gutterman said:
Lest I become regarded as "all hat and no cattle" I think it's time to post some progress pics. I had thought to wait until I got the main deck house finished, but that is a lot slower process than I had anticipated. A common misconception that I appear to be heir to. Just making all the little components to assemble the tiny parts necessary, in this case the paneled sliding doors and windows, is a time consuming and fiddley process.
It is well to have an assortment of chisels and gouges in a sufficient variety of shapes, sizes and widths to make the tiny cuts necessary to accurately cut out the pieces desired at scale without the use of laser cutting apparatus and CAD equipment. A mechanical pencil, some old-fashioned drafting instruments, A light table box for tracing and small, sharp cutting tools will get you there. This equipment may be retro but is far less expensive, with a much gentler learning curve than the afore mentioned tech apparatus. I am using a combination of Bristol cardstock board.1/64" birch ply and an assortment of commercially available "scale lumber" for materials. I hope the pictures will prove sufficiently self-explanatory to dispense with long winded descriptions of process. Any questions, please feel free to ask.View attachment 463781View attachment 463782View attachment 463783View attachment 463785View attachment 463786View attachment 463787View attachment 463788View attachment 463789View attachment 463790View attachment 463791View attachment 463792

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I appreciate the finer hand crafted pieces. However, Along with hand crafted pieces...I like to incorporate modified after market doodads. I like re-engineering other people's stuff to my own purpose. It's that *Hack* in me.
I might even start my own build log sooner than later...due to the fact, I am already building parts for my Staghound.
I'm not going to wait for the laser cut bulkheads to arrive...before I begin building parts that don't need the hull to work on.

Good job getting that main cabin worked up. Flying Clouds main cabin was about 2ft shorter than Staghounds....and a bit narrower too. Still, they had very similar arrangements.....with the galley to the aft.

Good work with those tinny chisels.

Rob
 
More to follow. As I said, it's a long, involved process. I hope to have the main deck house done by the end of the week, but I still haven't settled on its final appearance. The doors went through several iterations before I arrived at the three-panel arrangement for simplicities' sake and to provide an upper panel large enough to create the arch topped configuration most akin to Donald McKay's apparent decorative taste.

A word in defense of the BlueJacket offering of the herald angel figurehead. Its proportions and scale are accurate. It is not too crudely modeled, not the most artistic rendering, but not un-attractive and certainly acceptable (IMHO). Best of all it is still available for a modest six bucks. Otherwise, you are left with carving or modeling your own, which I did. A not inconsiderable undertaking. Remember, these figureheads were historically the products of thriving class of highly trained artisan-artists, handed down through generations of carvers dedicated to a craft which had long been regarded a necessary cultural asset. Unfortunately, something that is no longer so regarded. Not of much interest or of much value beyond what is generally dismissed as the arcane considerations of a few artist-historians, conservators, restorers, collectors and hobbyists such as ourselves.
 
The above was meant to follow my pictorial post on my progress on the main cabin and was somehow separated in the order of postings. The functioning of this website is, and apparently will remain a mystery to me. :rolleyes:
Rob, Thanks for the compliment for my use with ( I believe you meant to say: "tiny") chisels. A skill requiring much time and practice, such as demonstrated by your beautiful re-creation of the "Staghound" figurehead! We can't all be Lloyd Mcaffreys (just ask Lloyd Mccaffrey).
As for re-engineering "hacking" or "bashing" stuff that is commercially available, I am solidly in your corner. I simply refer you to the title of this thread.ROTF
 
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Rob,
If I may ask. Who are you using to laser cut your bulkheads? When built large scale aircraft, I used several laser cutters to cut parts like ribs and bulkheads. I have thought of doing that for my build.

Bill
 
rwiederrich said:
Rich...this is the best rendition I have seen of the Angel of Flying Cloud.. Every one I see presented by model companies is holey unacceptable. Short, squat, clumsy looking and way to large.

Good job.

Rob
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Rob,
Thanks for the fine compliment! Knowing that Mr. Gleason who carved the lovely, lifelike Grecian goddess Athene for Glory of the Seas also did the decorative work on Shooting Star you can see how I tried to emulate his style for Flying Cloud.
 
rwiederrich said:
This is the rendition of the angel on the bow of the scaled down version of the Flying Cloud built in the 1950"s

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Peter,
With your permission, I edited and enlarged your photo to make it easier to see. This image reveals a lot of unfortunate mistakes in this otherwise impressive effort. I've shared this Muir photo before but it bears repeating to show how more solidly a real McKay bow was constructed compared to a genuine attempt at replication but with inaccurate information. Besides missing navel hoods and cutwater, there's the obviously awkward mounting of an angelic figurehead to a bare stem and her bowsprit above. The figurehead is dated with her feet standing on puffy clouds and her trumpet isn't period accurate either. That, and both of the bowsprit and jibboom are just mounted too low. The inner jibboom should be flush with the monkey rail upper molding with the bowsprit mounted just below that. A damn shame too, as the real Flying Cloud prow was quite lovely and yacht like.

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A bit more progress today. Painted the 1/64" ply backing strip for the doors a darker shade of pearl for contrast. The doorframe and panel assembly. Windows and doors dry fitted to the cabin for test arrangement and some trimming of the windows for width.20240809_150751.jpg20240809_160159.jpg20240809_162610.jpg Each door must have an adjacent pocket width to accommodate opening. The arrangement of doors and windows (there will be two doors on the back wall of the house) will accommodate at least a couple of possible interior arrangements, as suggested by existing contemporary or early evidence.20240809_153841.jpg
 
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Bill-R said:
Rob,
If I may ask. Who are you using to laser cut your bulkheads? When built large scale aircraft, I used several laser cutters to cut parts like ribs and bulkheads. I have thought of doing that for my build.

Bill
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Our associate Vladimir, had Glory’s done too. Unfortunately he lives in Slavocia , and used a local shop there.

Rob
 
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WilliamM said:
Gentlemen,

I have been learning so much with your pictures and discussion! As you know, I am mostly a builder of warships, but I have encountered so many models of them that have gross inaccuracies. Research, photos, books, etc. are invaluable!

Bill
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WilliamM; Peter,
In his description of the trumpet bearing winged angel figurehead of Flying Cloud, Duncan McLean refers back to his impression of the previous figurehead on Shooting Star another clipper launched March 6th, 1851 from Medford, MA. Naturally, being curious about this other vessel, I looked it up and again thanks to Lars Bruzelius' excellent site, found the Boston Daily Atlas article on this beautiful little clipper. Here are excerpts describing this earlier work of Mr. W.B. Gleason, and for those who want to read the entire article, here's the link:


Anyone who's become familiar with my repeated references to what Rob and I now call "the unique McKay bow, will notice complete absence of such references to this vessel. That's because this ship featured both headboards and trailboards as ornamental embellishment in the bow which featured a simple cutwater attached to the stem.

Latest attachment is a contemporary photo of the 1869 Boston clipper Great Admiral. She's sporting a standard bow, which has a simple cutwater, beautifully embellished with ornate gilded carvings and the full figurehead of Admiral David Farragut. He was a national hero who electrified the North during the Civil War, as Flagship Commander of the Steam Sloop of War USS Hartford. His most famous moment was in the Civil War Battle of Mobile Bay, Alabama. It's where he uttered the famous war cry "Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!" His brilliant, courageous leadership led to the Union breakthrough which gave full control of the last Southern port to the North. This prevented Blockade Runners from resupplying the Confederacy. It also led to President Lincoln's reelection a few months later.

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A little more work on the main deck house. the pictures don't reflect all the little steps of painting, trimming, sizing, arranging, assembly, dis-assembly, re-assembly, puzzling, and fiddly gluing. (The Aileen's quick grab is my go-to for this application.) I have the sliding windows20240803_131733 (1).jpg20240808_154749.jpg20240812_151644.jpg20240812_150316.jpg20240803_132319 (1).jpg20240812_160131.jpg20240812_160330.jpg and doors finalized and glued to the front and starboard side. Port side and two doors and ladders on back to go, plus boat skids, boats and a galley stack on the roof. Each of these deck pieces is a complex, time and labor-intensive little model in its own right. I'm thinking of adding Gothic frame and panel decorative panels below the windows as per Donald McKay's purported taste. Opinions?
 
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Peter Gutterman said:
Lest I become regarded as "all hat and no cattle" I think it's time to post some progress pics. I had thought to wait until I got the main deck house finished, but that is a lot slower process than I had anticipated. A common misconception that I appear to be heir to. Just making all the little components to assemble the tiny parts necessary, in this case the paneled sliding doors and windows, is a time consuming and fiddley process.
It is well to have an assortment of chisels and gouges in a sufficient variety of shapes, sizes and widths to make the tiny cuts necessary to accurately cut out the pieces desired at scale without the use of laser cutting apparatus and CAD equipment. A mechanical pencil, some old-fashioned drafting instruments, A light table box for tracing and small, sharp cutting tools will get you there. This equipment may be retro but is far less expensive, with a much gentler learning curve than the afore mentioned tech apparatus. I am using a combination of Bristol cardstock board.1/64" birch ply and an assortment of commercially available "scale lumber" for materials. I hope the pictures will prove sufficiently self-explanatory to dispense with long winded descriptions of process. Any questions, please feel free to ask.View attachment 463781View attachment 463782View attachment 463783View attachment 463785View attachment 463786View attachment 463787View attachment 463788View attachment 463789View attachment 463790View attachment 463791View attachment 463792

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Pete! She's really looking great! Your resourcefulness is inspiring! Love how you made the shapes you needed using wood carving tools to cut the card stock!

Blessings!
Chuck
 
Peter,.
Here's actual gothic panels from, I'm sure you'll easily guess, Glory of the Seas once again. Apologies for the blurry image but it's the best available. My feeling is still that "a picture is worth a thousand words." Look closely, you'll see exactly how cabinet style panels appeared on McKay ships. They were interspersed in-between windows on the upper section of the fore house.

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ClipperFan said:
Peter,.
Here's actual gothic panels from, I'm sure you'll easily guess, Glory of the Seas once again. Apologies for the blurry image but it's the best available. My feeling is still that "a picture is worth a thousand words." Look closely, you'll see exactly how cabinet style panels appeared on McKay ships. They were interspersed in-between windows on the upper section of the fore house.

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Reeeeeeeeeally fuzzy!ROTF
 
Peter Gutterman said:
Thanks, Chuck. when you get the bathroom done, I'm eagerly anticipating the next "Harriet Lane" installment! :D
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Good morning, Pete! The bathroom's been done since July 8. Challenging summer. And now the semester begins. Planning to do some posting this week :p

Your build displays a wonderful audacity - I so happy you persevered! Inspiring!

Blessings.
 
I look forward to your posts. If the model is any indication, you newly remodeled bathroom must be a gem! Thumbsup

You and yours be blessed as well.

Pete
 
Peter Gutterman said:
A little more work on the main deck house. the pictures don't reflect all the little steps of painting, trimming, sizing, arranging, assembly, dis-assembly, re-assembly, puzzling, and fiddly gluing. (The Aileen's quick grab is my go-to for this application.) I have the sliding windowsView attachment 464578View attachment 464579View attachment 464580View attachment 464581View attachment 464583View attachment 464585View attachment 464598 and doors finalized and glued to the front and starboard side. Port side and two doors and ladders on back to go, plus boat skids, boats and a galley stack on the roof. Each of these deck pieces is a complex, time and labor-intensive little model in its own right. I'm thinking of adding Gothic frame and panel decorative panels below the windows as per Donald McKay's purported taste. Opinions?
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Outstanding! However, I would like to make one recommendation. I read on this forum that one builder uses a different technique for painting windows. He starts with painting a white dot in each, painting orange around it, followed by yellow around the orange. After all, these ships used candles for lighting. That is what he was trying to emulate; he did a great job. Have you ever attempted such an approach?

Bill
 
Thanks for the appreciation! I've never tried that painting approach (let alone even thought of it. Very clever!) Thanks for the tip. For now, I'll stick with the sky reflection in daylight. (Should anyone ask. No one ever has.) This job is tediously slow as it is. There are some aspects where easy is as far as I want to go. ;)Mostly none of it is easy.:rolleyes:
Remember, this stuff is tiny.
 
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