HIGH HOPES, WILD MEN AND THE DEVIL’S JAW - Willem Barentsz Kolderstok 1:50

I want to extend a special word of thanks to @Frank48 Frank who has helped me an incredible amount with this research. I have lost count of the number of the sources that he was able to source from all over the world. This allowed me to cross-check and cross-reference all of De Veer's diaries, including the English and German translations. In this regard, I found the Hakluyt Society and the Linschoten Vereeniging particularly helpful.

Then I also have to thank Martijn van Wijngarden from the Zeeuws Archives - he has truly done everything he could to give ma as much information as he possibly could about De Zwaan and the Griffioen. For someone with a lot more guts than me, the Griffioen will make an amazing scratch-build project. I just love the description of the Griffioen as an "ill-mannered" ship. It sounds much better in Dutch though - een ongemanierde schip!
 
pingu57 said:
And that is very strange, you are right about that, but perhaps there was at that point a change in the board of directors, and that was bye the way also the start off the VOC Verenigde Oostindische Compagnie, so perhaps the first two trips where under the auspiciën of the Admiralty, and the third trip under auspiciën from the VOC, who knowes??
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I would say that the fact that there is no name is an even greater mystery to me than what the actual name could have been! :)
 
Heinrich said:
I want to extend a special word of thanks to @Frank48 Frank who has helped me an incredible amount with this research. I have lost count of the number of the sources that he was able to source from all over the world. This allowed me to cross-check and cross-reference all of De Veer's diaries, including the English and German translations. In this regard, I found the Hakluyt Society and the Linschoten Vereeniging particularly helpful.

Then I also have to thank Martijn van Wijngarden from the Zeeuws Archives - he has truly done everything he could to give ma as much information as he possibly could about De Zwaan and the Griffioen. For someone with a lot more guts than me, the Griffioen will make an amazing scratch-build project. I just love the description of the Griffioen as an "ill-mannered" ship. It sounds much better in Dutch though - een ongemanierde schip!
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Hi Heinrick, it was nice to be able to help you, but I will try to find this third ship. Good wind
 
Heinrich said:
I would say that the fact that there is no name is an even greater mystery to me than what the actual name could have been!
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Yes, you are right about this Heinrich, almost a reason to investigate that also, but that result does't bring you the name of the ship and the brave men sailing it, so that does't bring any extra value.
I think that we learned a lot of this journeys, and that we have to appriciate this
 
pingu57 said:
Yes, you are right about this Heinrich, almost a reason to investigate that also, but that result does't bring you the name of the ship and the brave men sailing it, so that does't bring any extra value.
I think that we learned a lot of this journeys, and that we have to appriciate this
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Absolutely Peter. What these men accomplished - irrespective of the fact that they did not find the Northern Passage - is immense.
 
Heinrich said:
Buona fortuna amico mio!
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Gedenkwaardige beschryving van de achtjarige en zeer avontuurlyke reise van Willem Ysbrantsz Bontekoe van Hoorn, gedaan na Oost-Indien, bevattende vele wonderlyke en gevaarlyke zaken, my op dezelve reise wedervaren. Ook è hier bygevoegt een verhaal van Dirk Albertz. Raven, Kommandeur op 't schip Spitsbergen, gedestineert na Groenland
di Bontekoe, Willem Ysbrandsz., 1587-1647 circa
 
Dear Heinrich,
Well that was a journey I never expected to go on, one could be forgiven thinking we were is a research institution instead of a model ship forum, great work and persistence in your pursuit of answers, the journey can often be just as satisfying as the destination itself.
 
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Frank48 said:
Gedenkwaardige beschryving van de achtjarige en zeer avontuurlyke reise van Willem Ysbrantsz Bontekoe van Hoorn, gedaan na Oost-Indien, bevattende vele wonderlyke en gevaarlyke zaken, my op dezelve reise wedervaren. Ook è hier bygevoegt een verhaal van Dirk Albertz. Raven, Kommandeur op 't schip Spitsbergen, gedestineert na Groenland
di Bontekoe, Willem Ysbrandsz., 1587-1647 circa
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Thank you very much Frank - Bontekoe's story is equally fascinating but very different from Barentsz's.
 
Kolderstok said:
Hmm, don't think so, as the VOC was founded in 1602.
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You are correct Hans. The third trip was still very much done under the auspices of the Admiralty of Amsterdam. Actually "Admiralty" is not correct - it was the Staten Generaal of Amsterdam.
 
Richie said:
Dear Heinrich,
Well that was a journey I never expected to go on, one could be forgiven thinking we were is a research institution instead of a model ship forum, great work and persistence in you pursuit of answers, the journey can often be just as satisfying as the destination itself.
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I agree fully. The journey was very satisfying while the result is what it is. I am glad though that I have done it and that I have satisfied myself. Obviously there are still many unanswered questions and whilst I won't stop looking, the main focus now will be on building again.
 
Dear Friends

Things are not going too well at the moment with @pietsan Piet Sanders. For a long time now he has had severe back problems and have also suffered lately from a serious inflammation of his wrist. Now to top it all, he has to go to the hospital on Wednesday for a heart catherization. Piet on behalf of everyone on our WB log, I wish you all the success with the operation and a speedy recovery to full strength.

微信图片_20220421112221.jpg
 
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Heinrich said:
Dear Friends

Things are not going too well at the moment with @pietsan Piet Sanders. For a long time now he has had severe back problems and have also suffered lately from a serious inflammation of his wrist. Now to top it all, he has to go to the hospital on Wednesday for a heart catherization. Piet on behalf of everyone on our WB log, I wish him all the success with the operation and a speedy recovery to full strength.

View attachment 308805
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Good Morning Heinrich. I finally had some time to start looking at your log again. A research paper and historical debate of note !! Doing business with the Dutch corporates for the past week is an eye opener - they are so organised, detailed and "linear" in their approach. No wonder they build great models;). I think they thought us South Africans are mad...complete risk takers willing to take an out of the box idea with "we will just make it work" approach. Credit to them though after a week of thrashing it out and running it through many test models they came to the party. Now the pressure is on my team to make it happen. Amsterdam is an amazing and beautiful city, I wish I had more time to discover it.

Beautiful post for Piet. Get well Piet and speedy recovery. Cheers Grant
 
GrantTyler said:
Good Morning Heinrich. I finally had some time to start looking at your log again. A research paper and historical debate of note !! Doing business with the Dutch corporates for the past week is an eye opener - they are so organised, detailed and "linear" in their approach. No wonder they build great models;). I think they thought us South Africans are mad...complete risk takers willing to take an out of the box idea with "we will just make it work" approach. Credit to them though after a week of thrashing it out and running it through many test models they came to the party. Now the pressure is on my team to make it happen. Amsterdam is an amazing and beautiful city, I wish I had more time to discover it.

Beautiful post for Piet. Get well Piet and speedy recovery. Cheers Grant
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Good morning my friend - it is great to have you back! Yes a lot of water has flowed into the sea since you were here last. I love your observation about the Dutch vs the South Africans. It seems that at the end of the 16th century, they were very much the same as what us South Africans are now - grabbing an idea and making it work ROTF ! The only difference is that they evolved into an organized and detailed way of thinking, while we ... well, you know what I'm trying to say! :) On the other hand though, I have always been a risk taker so I like that part of being a South African!
 
Johan did you see how Bontekoe's story started? In the year of our Lord xxx he sailed on the ship Nieuw Hoorn ..... Why can't they all be like that and have the name/s of ship/s in the first sentence??? :)
 
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