initial Soleil royal using the heller 1/100 scale kit (post prepared in advance)

Hubac’s Historian said:
I would definitely do a full plexi case; all that rigging is a dust magnet, and these models are murder to clean.
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I know, I've had the experience already some time ago:)) when I was much younger I had made the 1/96 USS Constitution from Revell, and though I did the rigging nicely, the paint job wasn't very good:))) It gathered a lot of dust and when I tried to clean it, I started to break a lot of the hooks, pulleys and yards, and it ended up in the garbage after sitting for some time; now the next one was a wooden kit, and I didn't make that mistake again, but the casing cost more than the kit:)))))) here are some pics; it is 35 years old and has a mountain of mistakes, but it still looks ok for the un-initiated:)))

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while reading your document, I'm starting to wonder if I shouldn't use the drawing page 18 for the breadth/placement of the windows since it seem to show a room from before the refit. Would the "demi chassis" look like what was done on the victorieux or something else? (I had to restard reading it, I managed to forgot where I stopped, now I'm further ahead than before and I continue reading the LOS! 63 too). I don't see any mistakes on your model to be honest.
 
The theoretical Demi-windows would have pretty much followed the actual contour of the stern face, and only on the bottom row of the window set up; now, it could also have been what they did in those days and only be ''false windows'' meaning a painted window pattern, not a real one; the demi spaces on the diagram are the panels, or spaces at each end of the window row....
 
That I understand, I can use that as the basis for a initial SR? I wonder on the pilars why did you mixed blue and red and what led you to the order you choosed. So the panels/false windows wouldn't be on the decks above like what was done for the victorieux, only 1 deck
 
Yes only the bottom window row; the colors are actually on the Tanneron:))) you just need to look carefully at the color of the ''textured'' inserts and you'll find the ones meant to be red are lighter than the ones meant to be blue, but you have to be careful with the old and newer wood, the lighting and some interpretations....Then, you find out that there is some Berain influence into the color pattern; so the question is; are the colors on the textured wood inserts a supposition from the people who updated it at some point? ( it didn't hve that color pattern initially) and if so, what reference have they used? did they ''mix and matched'' the colors on the refit version? or is it the opposite and the refit was inspired from the first iteration ? I'll let you decide that:)))))))))
 
So it's guesswork for the pillars color pattern since it might not be how tanneron did it originally or what it was on the initial SR since tanneron color choices depended on what sources he had at the time. I might be able to see some kind of red on the pillars in this pic https://mnm.webmuseo.com/ws/musee-national-marine/app/collection/record/38531 Note the museum consider it as a representation of the post refit SR based on berain drawing btw, but I'm not convinced since there are more than 1 possible interpretation of the model possible. For the above deck, they wouldn't have those false windows, only windows.
 
This is the initial look of the tanneron.... He had no intention of putting any color on it beside the black strakes (préceintes) and the upper rear portion; he did interpret Dassie's mention of ''listons d'or'' by making the in-between strakes very bright and followed it on the bottles...
But what we know is there was some blue on the ship, as well as some beige (ventre de biche) and white; if you combine that with what the artist at the museum did, and some information of the ship painting at the time, as well as information on the colors used, you then come out with what I described. This description considers all elements of the situation at the time, the artists (Le Brun, Girardon, Puget, Levry, Berain), Colbert's attitude, and the prices involved.....It is, and will always remain a hypothesis, but to decide on something else, you should have good historical arguments for doing so...

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so the colors on the model facade come from tanneron himself, then those who restored it used what tanneron did? Arent the historical arguments guesses too? For the stern, I'm going for the more realistic scenario over the full on gold one.
 
Full on gold is not a realistic hstoical scenario...... No, the original Tanneron didn't have any color except black and maybe the gold stripes ( if what is shown is gold) The rest of the sculpting is wood color; he used different woods to get a slight color variation....
 
aurélien wolff said:
So all the colors were added later by people after Tanneron, what do you mean by the color on the upper rear?
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The colors and wood tints were added when the maquette went in for a revamp and some very minor repairs which you can see on the stern face in one of the windows an at the extremities of the rows; the upper rear is the planking above the main battery so at the quarterdeck/ front castle and above that
 
aurélien wolff said:
So all the colors were added later by people after Tanneron, what do you mean by the color on the upper rear?
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I’m not understanding what you are saying about the Tanneron model. All the colors on that model are natural wood tones. The planking of the three main batteries is all walnut, which has turned a nice golden color over so many decades. The drift rails are also probably walnut. The black is all ebony. The carved works are all boxwood.

There has not been any tint or painted colors applied to this model - just the patina of age.
 
aurélien wolff said:
So the blue on the apollo panel would be Tanneron per example? By curiosity, what do you think of this book? https://www.amazon.fr/Royale-Vaisse...f1-a747-48ef831e0a49&pd_rd_i=2213023484&psc=1
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Maybe; I have read that book....It is the best book to get a good feeling of how it was in the days of Louis the XIVth; it is a must read if you want to start to understand the whys and hows of what was done....If you go to my references, it is there on top of the list....But, you need to read it thoroughly and not just cross read it........
 
GuyM said:
Maybe; I have read that book....It is the best book to get a good feeling of how it was in the days of Louis the XIVth; it is a must read if you want to start to understand the whys and hows of what was done....If you go to my references, it is there on top of the list....But, you need to read it thoroughly and not just cross read it........
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I agree. I learned about this book through Guy. I read it once, so far. It was amazingly helpful for context, as Guy says. I will re-read in the near future. This Christmas, I asked for Dassie. This, I think, will be tremendously helpful for understanding the First Marine.
 
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