Soleil Royal by Heller - an Extensive Modification and Partial Scratch-Build by Hubac’s Historian

Ah you got it twice, recover well from the second one. On the delphin at the end of each railing, you choosed to installl them because they were there post radoub and on the proposal showing the bouteille?
soleil-royal2%20.jpg

source: https://afcan.org/tribune_libre/soleil-royal.html
I noticed heller opened the bouteilles "galleries" on their most recent boxart (but didn't on the model)
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For many reasons that I explain in detail, throughout this log, I believe the Pierre Vary drawing above - which is really just a colorized rendition of the original Berain drawing - represents the new refit decor of the ship in 1688/89.

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Most of the scholars dispute the authenticity of this drawing because they fail to see any thematic consistency between the ornament of Berain’s undisputed stern drawing, and the ornamental style of the quarters. I argue, to the contrary, that there is correlation from top to bottom of the quarters.

It is true that there are exaggerations of draftsmanship and unnecessary complications of form in this drawing, however, one can not discount the discretion of the carpenters and sculptors in interpreting this drawing into an as-built reality.

Yes, to answer your question. I made those dolphins as trompe l’oeil ornaments that bracket these false windows on the main-deck level. Everything above this walkable gallery rail is a shallow trompe l’oeil amortisement; designed to look like a fully rounded and closed bottle, while remaining purely ornamental.

I expanded the frieze because it was simply too complex to confine to such a small area in 1/96, and I found that the prior location of the moulded drift-rails (which I sanded off) provided me the layout cues to make the frieze into a sort of wall-paper:

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What Heller modeled for the frieze is really just a simplification of Berain’s design: alternating shells and fleurs, and these rope-twist sculptures that delineate the paneling. It is not bad, considering the hand-made process for prototyping a large plastic kit in the 70’s.

The primary purpose of making this model - apart from the fact that I had the kit laying around the past 20 years - was to demonstrate in three dimensions that the stern and quarter decors can and were, in-fact designed to co-exist together. I don’t expect that I have won any converts from the academic community, but that is okay. I build to express the grandeur and artistry of what may have been, and to try and place the ship within a particular context of her career, just as Guy is doing with his model.

I make no claims to authoritative authenticity - merely that this is all a product of reason and educated guesswork, in the absence of concrete sources.

Straight from the box, the Heller stern and quarters are nice, but I can no longer see them as anything but a hybrid between the early constructions of the 1670’s and later constructions of the 1690’s.

The orthodoxy surrounding the color scheme is also just boring to me, at this stage, and as I argue with this model - I think it likely that a capital ship like SR would have been quite vividly painted as a means of accentuating her fabulous decor. This, in a way, would have been a form of compensation for the reduction in gold leaf that would certainly have applied to SR at the time of her rebuild; the costs of which, despite a thorough survey of the work to be done beforehand, quickly soared as the extent of rot in her timbers was revealed.

As France moves into construction phases throughout the 18th C, yes, a more uniform color coding would be applied to their fleet, so that by Napoleonic times all ships look the same. In the age of excess, though, a vessel honoring the most self-aggrandizing monarch of all time would reflect those excesses in ways great and small.

That is my informed opinion, anyway. There are so many things one can credibly do with this kit. One builder in Belgium is converting it into SR’s near sister La Reyne. A builder in Germany is making her into the St. Philippe of 1693.

I think it would be highly possible to do a Royal Louis of 1668:

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There are always compromises to be made with this sort of project, as certain aspects of the kit architecture are too difficult to reasonably alter, but the basic hull form is really pretty good, and the sheerline is excellent for an early representation.

So, what do you think you might do with your model Aurelien?
 
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On mine, I'm thinking of a intial SR before the radoub, so keeping most of the work heller did on the stern. I'll still open the bouteilles as Terranon did on his model as well as the windows. I'll remove heller moldings on the 1st deck of guns since they seem to be post radoub and replace them by another ornament and change the figurehead (as best as I can), I'll use the kit sails and rigging, will modify the guns and for the hull, I'll go for a full white one. Won't whiden it because it doesn't seem possible unless for a waterline build (something wich I don't intend to do). I asked my parents and they seem ok getting it for my birthday. Wouldn't turning it in a royal louis mean remaking the stern and all the sculpture/ornaments.
 
That sounds like an ambitious modification plan and one I will enjoy watching as it progresses.

Yes, to build the Royal Louis, one would have to completely re-model the stern and quarters and all of the sculptures.

My personal theory is that SR1 more closely resembled the Royal Louis of 1668, as above, in terms of structure. Dimensionally, SR of 1670 was only fractionally bigger in her principal dimensions than the RL 1668. My challenge is to apply SR’s ornamental allegory, as defined by Puget, to the basic structure you see above.

But, yes, all of that would involve an incredible amount of modification. Personally, I only have one of these kinds of plastic kit-bash projects in me. From here, I will move onto wood and total design without compromise.
 
What will be interesting will be the scratch and paint for me, I wonder on your foward facade (or front, a bit unsure what word to use in english), why didn't you added the same kind of ornament on the 2 portholes than on the sides one?
 
Hi Aurelien,

In English we call this the beakhead bulkhead. The simple answer is that it never occurred to ke to do so. Those port enhancements are what you see on the Berain/Vary drawings, but at the quarter deck/f’ocsle level. Since Heller (Tanneron, really) reversed levels for the round ports and these domed ports, I decided to add the port enhancements to the main deck level.

I seriously hadn’t thought of it, until you mentioned it, but I don’t think I would add them, at this point. There is more than enough going on, there, and I don’t see a need to clutter the area any more than it is.
 
In my opinion, it'd be somewhat more logical to have them there if they're going to be on both side 1st deck of guns. I knew about bulkhead (from reading mark chirnside excellent olympic class book), but beakhead. I wouldn't say it clutter too much, especialy taking other parts of the ship in account. Mine will stay like the Tanneron model since I want to a initial SR, but might add some fleur de lys too.
 
Thank you all for your well-wishes and for your kind comments. Although, I have generally felt pretty ok, throughout (congestion, mostly), today was my first day where I tested negative. It was nice to have a little time to rest, but my compulsive nature has me bouncing off the walls, at this point.

So, after much fiddling/fettling, I finally have the forward and mid supports dialed-in where I want them:

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But, for the fact that I underestimated the angle of the buttressing knees on the forward support:

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Okay, not a big deal; I added some plastic underneath the knee, so that I could fair the top surface flush with the headrail profile:

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After fairing, and adding the support ledge for the grate slats:

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I think the fleurs shaped up nicely, especially considering how small they actually are:

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I had to add some plastic to the foot of the split supports, in order to raise them up about a 1/16”, but that is not a big deal either. This is the beauty of a plastic build; you can make these mistakes and still salvage the part.

The next tricky bit of business is to fashion the forward terminus for the head grating, which fairs into the upper head knee.

More to follow..
 
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In my opinion, it'd be somewhat more logical to have them there if they're going to be on both side 1st deck of guns. I knew about bulkhead (from reading mark chirnside excellent olympic class book), but beakhead. I wouldn't say it clutter too much, especialy taking other parts of the ship in account. Mine will stay like the Tanneron model since I want to a initial SR, but might add some fleur de lys too.
To do so, would disrupt the spacing of my fleur layout, which I prefer over inclusion of the port enhancements.
 
Maybe removing the fleurs above and under the port, placing one next to them, then the enhancements would work? I'll make the supports for the bow too, not sure why heller didn't included it.
 
Hello,
a few years ago I had modeled and 3D printed these rear friezes for my friend Michel Saunier now deceased.
I was using a wire frame printer at the time.
I think that a 3d resin printer of today could make these decorations on a much smaller scale.

__Saunier_1200.jpg

Bernard
 
Hello,
a few years ago I had modeled and 3D printed these rear friezes for my friend Michel Saunier now deceased.
I was using a wire frame printer at the time.
I think that a 3d resin printer of today could make these decorations on a much smaller scale.

View attachment 337341

Bernard
Sorry to hear that Michel is not with us any more. Very sad news.
I met Michel in October 2018 during the international convention (I was part of the german / austrian delegation) in Rochefort and made several photos of Michel Saunier´s wonderful model

 
Sorry to hear that Michel is not with us any more. Very sad news.
I met Michel in October 2018 during the international convention (I was part of the german / austrian delegation) in Rochefort and made several photos of Michel Saunier´s wonderful model

That is an amazing model Uwe, thanks for sharing the photos.

Cheers,
Stephen.
 
On the beakhead bulkhead, Van de velde showed royal duc with ornaments on the portholes (so I think I'll do my initial SR with ornaments there too) and a frog (?), tho no fleur de lys visible (still open for interpretation since it's not the soleil royal)
la_rey10.jpg

source: this french build who seem to have stalled https://www.laroyale-modelisme.net/t19428-la-reine-vaisseau-de-premier-rang-au-1-90-eme
No ornaments visible on the guns doors tho.
 
I got a question on the rear, its planking and the main deck, how much plastic/styrene sheet did you used for it and do you think I can increase the stern breadth if I don't want to do it as a water line build?
Thanks for your answer!
 
I do not think it is possible to increase the breadth of the stern without cutting away the lower hull. The only way I could conceive of it was to do what I did and add inserts to either side of the stem. As for planking the lower transom and upper stern, I would say that I went through two packets of Evergreen strip, so far. Off the top of my head, I can’t remember what the particular dimensions were.

For the main deck, I bought a packet of Evergreen sheet. There are something like 6 sheets in a packet. Maybe each sheet is 8” x 10”. I used three separate sheets to do the main deck. I’ve cut, but not detailed the f’ocsle sheet. I still have one full sheet from this packet.

Bear in mind that if you intend to model the Berain/Vary quarter galleries, as I have done, then you will also want to add extensions to the hull from the stern counter, on up. Without the extra real estate, the spacing doesn’t work out in a pleasing way. There’s so much going on there, that it is hard to not make it look cramped. I even had to move the lowest, aft gunport forward by a 1/4” so that it wouldn’t interfere with the lower finishing.
 
Ok, I intend for a initial soleil royal, would the windows modification be possible without increasing the breadth? It seems tanneron made a mistake there or didn't had enough information. For the length, it's hard to do too for a initial I guess, I wonder how different both breadth and length would be in mm (when it come to dimension innacuracies, I'm the kind who prefer not to correct them if it's not too visible, per example the 747 advanced freighter is 3mm longer at 1/144 than a normal 8F so on mine I didn't bothered to change the fuselage length, both put side by side, the difference isn't visible). Weren't the berain/vary quarter galleries only for the post refit SR?
Thanks for your answers, I'm still going through your thread (and many others) for inspiration and how to build mine.
 
My understanding is that Tanneron’s model, dimensionally, is based upon SR2 of 1693, and as a result, it is somewhat longer than the original. For the purposes of making a representative model, I think these dimensional differences are negligible.

Yes, my belief is that the Berain/Vary quarters represent the refit ornamentation of 1689/90. The earliest incarnation of the ship probably had terraced quarters like the Monarque, for example:

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I think one can still represent a six window stern without widening the stern, but you would have to re-scale the windows to fit, and it all would need to be made from scratch, obviously.

The version of my log that exists here, on SOS, is an abbreviated version of the main log on Model Ship World, where the early stages of the build exist in great detail. It was too tedious to fully reproduce here, so I only did a summary at the beginning of this page.

 
Playing with the windows size is what I thought to do on mine, the original royal louis is described as having 6 windows, Gallica has the original french description of the ship, with show royal louis already had ornaments on its port doors https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b86069950/f19.item (it made me learn a few thing on old french btw). I think it's still safe to keep the Tanneron quarter gallerys, obligatory opening them on the heller kt.
 
I noticed the monarque doesn't has the same pattern around the fleur de lys as the Berain soleil royal drawings (I thought they were Vary, I see they seem from Berein now) so for a intial Sr, they're not an obligation.
Both Saulnier, and Neko choosed to place the "molures/Frize dorée" (page 29 of royal louis description) on the 3rd battery (wich might've been Tanneron choice given the ports look verry different there than the one below).
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source: https://5500.forumactif.org/t52p520-soleil-royal-1669-echelle-1-72
My initial SR "molure" will roughly look like what they did.
 
On the beakhead bulkhead, Van de velde showed royal duc with ornaments on the portholes (so I think I'll do my initial SR with ornaments there too) and a frog (?), tho no fleur de lys visible (still open for interpretation since it's not the soleil royal)
la_rey10.jpg

source: this french build who seem to have stalled https://www.laroyale-modelisme.net/t19428-la-reine-vaisseau-de-premier-rang-au-1-90-eme
No ornaments visible on the guns doors tho.

The frog-looking ornament is likely the French coat of arms:

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It doesn’t show up so great in the portrait above, either, but it makes sense that it would be present at both the bow and the stern.

Fleur-de-lis were a common beakhead embellishment:

4DD814F2-92E9-425C-A4D1-EC86ED939130.jpeg
 
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