1:20 Scale Victory & Constitution Gun Models by Signet [COMPLETED BUILD]

[Uwek]

I think also, that it is a flat bar

V Is For Victory - CALIBRE

Made famous during the Battle of Trafalgar, the HMS Victory is often regarded as Britain’s greatest warship, says Peter Goodwin.

calibremag.com

Not easy to handle, but maybe this page and the attachment could be of some help - there is one detailed sketch of a carriage available

https://www.worldnavalships.com/forums/thread.php?threadid=6692

or this one (but it seems to be from 1825

Naval & Military | Ryan M Cooper Nautical Antiques & Art

Naval and Military items include Revolutionary War, Civil War, War of 1812 sailor and officer items: uniforms, hats, weapons, ship's equipment. Items from historic vessels: USS Constitution, Kearsarge, Hartford.

www.rmcnauticalantiques.com

 

[Uwek]

I think I have found the correct drawing - it is flat iron

The drawing is showing the carriage with view from above AND BELOW

Excellent (1787)​

Scale: 1:24. Plan showing the elevation of the gun and carriage, and split view of the carriage to show the construction from above and below, relating to a new Truck Carriage for a 68 pounder or ten inch Gun sent to HMS Excellent (1787), a 74-gun Third Rate, two-decker, possible after she was cut down to a 56-gun Frigate. The date of the plan is based on ZAZ6992.

NMM, Progress Book, volume 6, folio 88, states that in December 1825 she was 'Taken in hand' at Portsmouth Dockyard, but no details are given regarding the work carried out.

Excellent (1787) | Royal Museums Greenwich

www.rmg.co.uk

We see the same appearance at the front wheel like on other drawings, but now here also with the view from below

 

[Signet]

I think also, that it is a flat bar

Yes, your references make a great point in favor of the flat bar too. Possibly smaller than the size of the capsquares, but similar. Thanks for all the references! Love to see the details, and differences, among otherwise similar carriages.

 

[Signet]

Capsquares, oh capsquares, where for out thou? Ah, the saga of a person of limited abilities and experience trying to make decent looking parts for ship models. We've all been there at one time or another. While in the past I've gotten away with simulating capsquares with as little as black paint, somehow I felt that wouldn't suffice for a 1:20 model. For any of you who might not know or remember what capsquares are, they're the metal pieces that hold barrels in place on naval guns, while allowing the barrels to be quickly replaced:



On the Constitution's 24-pounders a detail of the capsquares look like this:


I liked the idea of making them from brass; in fact, I considered making all hardware of brass, and keeping it shiney and natural. It's a model for desktop decoration, after all, not a diorama, and carriages were never left natural wood, so I reasoned that polished brass and natural wood would look great. And it would, but with a variety of hardware used previously in the models, it became difficult. And even blackening was uneven and impossible with some materials. Still, brass would be the go-to material for capsquares. Heck, I even used brass on my 1:98 scale Victory cross section gun's capsquares.

So, I started raiding my accumulation of 50 years of brass pieces. Now, mind you, this is not a constant accumulation. There's been 30+ years gone by with no modeling, and no parts acquisition of any kind. But on the other hand, I'd never throw away any brass pieces either. Like most of you, I have a large assortment of rods, tubes, angles, channels, strips and some sheet. Not surprisingly, none of it the right thickness for the capsquares I wanted to make. So my first purchase was at Hobby Lobby for some 1/32" x 1/4" and 1/2" strips that would be fairly close. $12.82 spent. They turned out to be nice pieces of brass, but too wide for my purpose (even the 1/4"), even though the thickness was close. I tried cutting the pieces to narrower strips with a carbide saw, and that was a real bust. So I figured I'd file/sand it to width; it's brass, after all, right? Within seconds, I couldn't hold the piece. So held in pliers, I sanded and sanded and basically did nothing. I needed differing size pieces for a total of 6 capsquares of 3 sizes for these models, plus similar widths for the fore axletree braces, so that wasn't going to work.

After a thorough search of the Internet for correct width and thickness brass, I finally found what I wanted at Eileens Emporium, in England. They have an excellent selection of metric brass strips (12" or so long), reasonably priced (2-3 GBP each), so I got two sizes. With shipping that came to $17.39 (total $30.21 so far). I received the pieces a week or two later, and got to work, first softening the hardened brass by heating with a torch and allowing to slowly cool. I then made a "bending jig:

I took two pieces of hardwood, sapele I think, and drilled holes of the proper size for the trunnions and also the outside diameter of the capsquares, to use in combination to bend the brass strips. I drilled some right on the center between the two pieces, and some slightly off-center, as the Constitution's trunnions are actually centered 3/8" below the top of the carriage brackets.

Separating the pieces, I used a piece of solid brass rod, and a made-up piece of a brass rod and 2 pieces or styrene tubing to represent the trunnions prior to bending the capsquares:


Placing the appropriate trunnion rod in place between the two bored "patterns" and placing the brass strip in place, I used a small vise to bend the capsquares:

For the Constitution's guns, the capsquares are perpendicular to the trunnion, but for the Victory's guns, they are parallel to the side brackets, so I had to approximate the ~3 degree angle by keeping the strip at that angle. It's so easy to get confused and make two rights, and no left, I've found. During bending the strip begins to approximate the capsquares:

Despite multiple bending attempts, the results were okay, but not great:

Yeah, that would look fine on a small scale model (1:48 or smaller), but not great for this scale. I then tried a different bending method:

This made for a better fit around the "trunnion", then I'd just have to bend a right angle at the midway point to shape it properly. Well, that's easier said than done, as it's tough to get the bend sharp, and tougher yet to get it at exactly the mid-point that I needed. After a lot of playing around, and a lot of distortion of the wood pattern, this was the best I could do:

I'm sure it would have been better if my "pattern" were steel instead of wood, but I just couldn't see getting and machining steel to do this. And now I had to drill and slot hoes in the brass, tiny ones, and reasoned drilling would be a problem as well. I felt I needed to do better.

My next thought was to use pieces of brass tubing, split in half, along with pieces of brass strip and brass rod to construct the capsquares, soldered together. But I felt that would become a real mess, and the capsquare eye would have to be in place when soldering it. In addition, I'd still have to drill tiny holes in brass. A recipe for disaster, IMHO. So I decided to try using styrene, cemented together, instead of brass. When assembled and finished, I reasoned it would be indistinguishable from brass. I figured I'd make each capsquare out of 5 pieces:

The blue piece would be made from tubing split in half, the red of styrene strip or sheet, and the green of styrene rod. Over those same 50 years or so, I've also accumulated quite a few pieces of Evergreen styrene. Luckily, had the large tubing that I could split, but no strips wide enough or sheets of the right thickness for the red pieces. And of course no rods of the right diameter. For the 3 sizes of capsquares, I needed two different diameters of tubing, 2 different diameters of rod, and two different thickness of sheet. I decided to get everything I would ever need by ordering two assortments: the Evergreen Rod & Tube Assortment ($7.87) and the Evergreen Sheet Odds & Ends assortment ($12.67). Total cost so far $50.75. After everything was delivered, I selected the closest size of each for my capsquares, and began construction.

As the capsquares for the Victory's guns are parallel to the brackets, and therefore not at right angles to the trunnions, my cuts for each piece would be theoretically about 3 degrees from perpendicular. I calculated the tangent of the correct angle, and used my ruler to set the angle before cutting each piece:

Sounds precise, but in fact the result was not. Close enough for government work, though, I hoped.

Here's a half tube fitted on the trunnion, sanded until it fit well and touched the brackets. Left oversize width-wise to allow adjustment during assembly:


I then laid out the straight pieces of the capsquares on a strip cut from sheet:

Prior to cutting them apart, I drilled the holes for the eyes and bolts, holding the strip in a vise on my Proxxon drill press, and using the X-Y adjustable slide to keep the holes in line and consistent. Then the strip is cut them to length, attempting to get the right angle:


The 3 pieces are then glued together:


The rod at one end is attached, with the eye in place, as I felt it would be impossible to add later:

The groove in the piece of scrap lets the eye protrude lower, while keeping the styrene rod at the correct height. Even though I used Tamiya Plastic Cement, which I think just dissolves mating pieces to "weld" them together, to glue the pieces together, it was difficult to keep the eye moving freely and not bending the softened styrene at the rod. Took a couple tries, but eventually got them put together. I then sanded the sides of the tubing even with the strips which were properly sized:

This made me realize I could really use a Micro-Mark Sand-It, so have asked for it for Christmas. It should also be a much better way to create small, accurate angles, rather than try to cut it initially to the correct angle.

The pattern I made for bending actually worked well to hold the assemblies in place during sanding, as they are quite fragile:


This next picture shows the capsquare in place with the rod left long for handling and the opposite end rod in place. The center tape of course keeps the dummy trunnion in place. The side tape was positioned to indicate the proper hold location for the eyebolt.

Both completed capsquares are now in place, along with the eyebolts. Different carriage designs use different eyebolt or keeper configurations, and I'm trying to make them all different and accurate.

Both capsquares are now completed and painted, and work exactly like the original, so allow me to mount and then dismount the barrel:

This particular carriage will use a metal rod to secure the front of the capsquare (others use wedge-shaped flat bar). They will be secured by chain, so when changing the barrel, the rods/wedges don't get lost. Of course, that means I need small chain, I figure around 27 links per inch. And of course my 50 years, plus my wife's 30 years of jewelry-making, has not provided chain the right size. It's on order now, at a cost of $7.51 (new total $58.26). Oh, and I forgot, the rod and tube assortment included rods too small and too big for the round ends of the 24- and 32-pounder guns, but not the right size. So another $4.27 for the right diameter rod at Hobby Town (new total $62.53).

I'm happy with the way this first capsquare set has worked out, and being the smallest of the three, expect the others to be as good or better. But I struggle with the over $60 cost to produce them. Yeah, I know, I'll have all those extra materials to use on future projects, but every project seems to find new missing materials and additional purchases. Of course, during this project, I've drawn the capsquares in Autodesk Fusion 360:

and it appears I could have them printed in resin with a 3D printer for a cost of around $5 each (maybe less if connected together), for a total cost of $30 plus shipping. Probably even include the eyebolts and connectors and such with them. Would that be cheating? I don't know. I made the drawings, after all. Yet somehow that seems like too much of a shortcut. Still, if I had a 3D printer, or if my son had his set up and was willing, I think I'd do them in 3D. Maybe even try them anyhow. But I probably won't, as I'm kind of proud of the assembly I did make in this thread, and after all, don't want to waste that $62.53!

 

[Tobias]

Impressive work, great research.

 

[Signet]

Impressive work, great research.

Thank you! I love doing both!

 

[shota70]

Capsquares, oh capsquares, where for out thou? Ah, the saga of a person of limited abilities and experience trying to make decent looking parts for ship models. We've all been there at one time or another. While in the past I've gotten away with simulating capsquares with as little as black paint, somehow I felt that wouldn't suffice for a 1:20 model. For any of you who might not know or remember what capsquares are, they're the metal pieces that hold barrels in place on naval guns, while allowing the barrels to be quickly replaced:

View attachment 345929

On the Constitution's 24-pounders a detail of the capsquares look like this:
View attachment 345933

I liked the idea of making them from brass; in fact, I considered making all hardware of brass, and keeping it shiney and natural. It's a model for desktop decoration, after all, not a diorama, and carriages were never left natural wood, so I reasoned that polished brass and natural wood would look great. And it would, but with a variety of hardware used previously in the models, it became difficult. And even blackening was uneven and impossible with some materials. Still, brass would be the go-to material for capsquares. Heck, I even used brass on my 1:98 scale Victory cross section gun's capsquares.

So, I started raiding my accumulation of 50 years of brass pieces. Now, mind you, this is not a constant accumulation. There's been 30+ years gone by with no modeling, and no parts acquisition of any kind. But on the other hand, I'd never throw away any brass pieces either. Like most of you, I have a large assortment of rods, tubes, angles, channels, strips and some sheet. Not surprisingly, none of it the right thickness for the capsquares I wanted to make. So my first purchase was at Hobby Lobby for some 1/32" x 1/4" and 1/2" strips that would be fairly close. $12.82 spent. They turned out to be nice pieces of brass, but too wide for my purpose (even the 1/4"), even though the thickness was close. I tried cutting the pieces to narrower strips with a carbide saw, and that was a real bust. So I figured I'd file/sand it to width; it's brass, after all, right? Within seconds, I couldn't hold the piece. So held in pliers, I sanded and sanded and basically did nothing. I needed differing size pieces for a total of 6 capsquares of 3 sizes for these models, plus similar widths for the fore axletree braces, so that wasn't going to work.

After a thorough search of the Internet for correct width and thickness brass, I finally found what I wanted at Eileens Emporium, in England. They have an excellent selection of metric brass strips (12" or so long), reasonably priced (2-3 GBP each), so I got two sizes. With shipping that came to $17.39 (total $30.21 so far). I received the pieces a week or two later, and got to work, first softening the hardened brass by heating with a torch and allowing to slowly cool. I then made a "bending jig:
View attachment 345931
I took two pieces of hardwood, sapele I think, and drilled holes of the proper size for the trunnions and also the outside diameter of the capsquares, to use in combination to bend the brass strips. I drilled some right on the center between the two pieces, and some slightly off-center, as the Constitution's trunnions are actually centered 3/8" below the top of the carriage brackets.

Separating the pieces, I used a piece of solid brass rod, and a made-up piece of a brass rod and 2 pieces or styrene tubing to represent the trunnions prior to bending the capsquares:
View attachment 345934

Placing the appropriate trunnion rod in place between the two bored "patterns" and placing the brass strip in place, I used a small vise to bend the capsquares:
View attachment 345935
For the Constitution's guns, the capsquares are perpendicular to the trunnion, but for the Victory's guns, they are parallel to the side brackets, so I had to approximate the ~3 degree angle by keeping the strip at that angle. It's so easy to get confused and make two rights, and no left, I've found. During bending the strip begins to approximate the capsquares:
View attachment 345937
Despite multiple bending attempts, the results were okay, but not great:
View attachment 345939
Yeah, that would look fine on a small scale model (1:48 or smaller), but not great for this scale. I then tried a different bending method:
View attachment 345940
This made for a better fit around the "trunnion", then I'd just have to bend a right angle at the midway point to shape it properly. Well, that's easier said than done, as it's tough to get the bend sharp, and tougher yet to get it at exactly the mid-point that I needed. After a lot of playing around, and a lot of distortion of the wood pattern, this was the best I could do:
View attachment 345945
I'm sure it would have been better if my "pattern" were steel instead of wood, but I just couldn't see getting and machining steel to do this. And now I had to drill and slot hoes in the brass, tiny ones, and reasoned drilling would be a problem as well. I felt I needed to do better.

My next thought was to use pieces of brass tubing, split in half, along with pieces of brass strip and brass rod to construct the capsquares, soldered together. But I felt that would become a real mess, and the capsquare eye would have to be in place when soldering it. In addition, I'd still have to drill tiny holes in brass. A recipe for disaster, IMHO. So I decided to try using styrene, cemented together, instead of brass. When assembled and finished, I reasoned it would be indistinguishable from brass. I figured I'd make each capsquare out of 5 pieces:
View attachment 345946
The blue piece would be made from tubing split in half, the red of styrene strip or sheet, and the green of styrene rod. Over those same 50 years or so, I've also accumulated quite a few pieces of Evergreen styrene. Luckily, had the large tubing that I could split, but no strips wide enough or sheets of the right thickness for the red pieces. And of course no rods of the right diameter. For the 3 sizes of capsquares, I needed two different diameters of tubing, 2 different diameters of rod, and two different thickness of sheet. I decided to get everything I would ever need by ordering two assortments: the Evergreen Rod & Tube Assortment ($7.87) and the Evergreen Sheet Odds & Ends assortment ($12.67). Total cost so far $50.75. After everything was delivered, I selected the closest size of each for my capsquares, and began construction.

As the capsquares for the Victory's guns are parallel to the brackets, and therefore not at right angles to the trunnions, my cuts for each piece would be theoretically about 3 degrees from perpendicular. I calculated the tangent of the correct angle, and used my ruler to set the angle before cutting each piece:
View attachment 345950
Sounds precise, but in fact the result was not. Close enough for government work, though, I hoped.

Here's a half tube fitted on the trunnion, sanded until it fit well and touched the brackets. Left oversize width-wise to allow adjustment during assembly:
View attachment 345951

I then laid out the straight pieces of the capsquares on a strip cut from sheet:
View attachment 345952
Prior to cutting them apart, I drilled the holes for the eyes and bolts, holding the strip in a vise on my Proxxon drill press, and using the X-Y adjustable slide to keep the holes in line and consistent. Then the strip is cut them to length, attempting to get the right angle:
View attachment 345953

The 3 pieces are then glued together:
View attachment 345954

The rod at one end is attached, with the eye in place, as I felt it would be impossible to add later:
View attachment 345955
The groove in the piece of scrap lets the eye protrude lower, while keeping the styrene rod at the correct height. Even though I used Tamiya Plastic Cement, which I think just dissolves mating pieces to "weld" them together, to glue the pieces together, it was difficult to keep the eye moving freely and not bending the softened styrene at the rod. Took a couple tries, but eventually got them put together. I then sanded the sides of the tubing even with the strips which were properly sized:
View attachment 345957
This made me realize I could really use a Micro-Mark Sand-It, so have asked for it for Christmas. It should also be a much better way to create small, accurate angles, rather than try to cut it initially to the correct angle.

The pattern I made for bending actually worked well to hold the assemblies in place during sanding, as they are quite fragile:
View attachment 345958

This next picture shows the capsquare in place with the rod left long for handling and the opposite end rod in place. The center tape of course keeps the dummy trunnion in place. The side tape was positioned to indicate the proper hold location for the eyebolt.
View attachment 345956
Both completed capsquares are now in place, along with the eyebolts. Different carriage designs use different eyebolt or keeper configurations, and I'm trying to make them all different and accurate.

Both capsquares are now completed and painted, and work exactly like the original, so allow me to mount and then dismount the barrel:
View attachment 345959View attachment 345960
This particular carriage will use a metal rod to secure the front of the capsquare (others use wedge-shaped flat bar). They will be secured by chain, so when changing the barrel, the rods/wedges don't get lost. Of course, that means I need small chain, I figure around 27 links per inch. And of course my 50 years, plus my wife's 30 years of jewelry-making, has not provided chain the right size. It's on order now, at a cost of $7.51 (new total $58.26). Oh, and I forgot, the rod and tube assortment included rods too small and too big for the round ends of the 24- and 32-pounder guns, but not the right size. So another $4.27 for the right diameter rod at Hobby Town (new total $62.53).

I'm happy with the way this first capsquare set has worked out, and being the smallest of the three, expect the others to be as good or better. But I struggle with the over $60 cost to produce them. Yeah, I know, I'll have all those extra materials to use on future projects, but every project seems to find new missing materials and additional purchases. Of course, during this project, I've drawn the capsquares in Autodesk Fusion 360:
View attachment 345961
and it appears I could have them printed in resin with a 3D printer for a cost of around $5 each (maybe less if connected together), for a total cost of $30 plus shipping. Probably even include the eyebolts and connectors and such with them. Would that be cheating? I don't know. I made the drawings, after all. Yet somehow that seems like too much of a shortcut. Still, if I had a 3D printer, or if my son had his set up and was willing, I think I'd do them in 3D. Maybe even try them anyhow. But I probably won't, as I'm kind of proud of the assembly I did make in this thread, and after all, don't want to waste that $62.53!

Wow, that I call Strive for excellence
well done

 

[Signet]

Wow, that I call Strive for excellence
well done

Thank you very much!

 

[Signet]

I decided to next work on the capsquare for the USS Constitution's 24-Pounder gun. I would normally have finished the 12-pounder from the Victory, but haven't received the chain for the split key retainers on the capsquares, which require drill holes for mounts on the side brackets, so will get back to those. I didn't care much for the way I cut the semi-circular pieces for the capsquares, so tried a new way. I cut a length of 3/8" OD styrene tubing for the pieces, and slid it over a 5/16" dowel (same diameter as the trunnions):

After cutting off the excess dowel, I chucked it up in my lathe, aka electric hand drill, and after marking each length, cut off pieces of the tubing using a craft saw:

This definitely worked out better than my previous hand method. Maybe if I build enough guns for a 1:20 scale Victory, I'll get good at this!

I then cut a slit in the dowel, slightly off of center, to both provide for the saw kerf and allow extra material for sanding to a proper fit:

The longer piece of tubing gives me purchase to hold onto while holding the final pieces in place, without cutting my fingers.

Then I placed one tubing piece at a time onto the assembly, using the existing saw kerf to get the size I wanted:

And voila!


Test fitting on the carriage with the barrel and trunnion in place:

This piece is then sanded down until it holds the trunnion tightly. You'll probably notice on the final pictures that I somehow didn't one done very tight at all. Oh well.

In cutting the pieces on either side of the semi-circular piece, I marked their lengths on the appropriately cut to size piece of styrene, and calculated the distance from one hole to the next, using the end of the piece as a start, and the 1mm per turn calibration of the XY table to space the holes out.


Initially, I couldn't figure out how to make the slot in the Fore Capsquare bolt (in red below). I couldn't imagine milling a slot 0.016" wide. I ended up finding I could cut the slot with a saw, from the bottom, as only the slot above the capsquare would show. I made them to sit on top of the bracket, and intended to drill holes into it slightly to attach the round portion of the bolt:

My slots were ended up not well centered, and it was a bust trying to drill into the bottom of the piece, what with the slot and all. The results were not good:


I then decided not to use a rod attached to the pieces, but have them longer and glued into rectangular slots in the brackets instead of round holes. But I needed a better and more accurate way to make the longer slots. I ended up taking the 4 pieces (basic size for the 32-pounder is the same), and used an abrasive disc in a drill press to make the cut:

Using the XY adjustment, I just took 1mm deep passes until it was deep enough.

The results were better (new, longer cuts on the right, previous shorter, uneven ones on the left). One cut to length, but not shaped:


The resulting pieces aren't perfect, but definitely better:


Assembly of the capsquares is similar to previous, adding the flat pieces, then the round end on the fore portion:

Then cementing in the retainers into the slotted holes in the brackets:

Checking the fit with the capsquares (also with the trunnion, not shown):

The round capsquare aft end was added, and holes for the aft eyebolts drilled as done previously with the 12-Pounder. After painting the capsquares and adding iron rings around axletrees outboard of the trucks and their retainers, I have a completed carriage, awaiting its barrel:

A couple more pics of the completed carriage showing views which the barrel will block, and the underside:



The above view shows the fore axletree braces, different than those on the Victory, but per the Constitution drawings (discussed above).

After placing the barrel, the split keys are inserted, here left natural to show up better:

I didn't notice until I was posting this that I forgot to put the chamfer on the top of the keys, so may go back and add them and repaint.

Finally, the completed 24-Pounder Gun for the USS Constitution, in all its (imagined) glory:




I didn't want to glue the quoin/coin in place in place, but didn't want it to fall off either, so used a couple tiny spots of Blue Stuff to hold it in place.

Well, the chain is supposed to come tomorrow, so I can work on the other two guns. The Victory clearly used chains to prevent loss of the split keys, but the Constitution, as near as I can determine, did not use them. No pictures show any chain of any kind, and the details of the part do not have the hole necessary to attach a chain.

Until then.....

 

[Corsair]

wow ! Quite the adventure !
They are looking great !

 

[dockattner]

Awesome! How fun it must be to build at this scale!

 

[Signet]

Awesome! How fun it must be to build at this scale!

Yes, definitely! The bad is that pretty much everything is scratch made, but the good is that it is big enough to build (and for me to see, at least with magnifying lenses).

 

[Signet]

wow ! Quite the adventure !
They are looking great !

Thank you so much!

 

[Kurt Konrath]

The gun and carriage look amazing, but at this scale, the lack of hole for the wick in the end of barrel kind of stands out.

Maybe drill a hole and stick a strand or just leave a hole for where it would go if it were ready for actions.

Do you have any idea of what kind of display base they will be shown on?

 

[Signet]

The gun and carriage look amazing, but at this scale, the lack of hole for the wick in the end of barrel kind of stands out.

Thank you. The touch hole is there, a 1/2" drilled hole scaled to 0.025" in diameter, but it's recessed a bit the way the barrel is cast around it at that point. Plus with the texture of the barrel, it makes it harder to see. And now you can see that it isn't well centered. :-(

Maybe drill a hole and stick a strand or just leave a hole for where it would go if it were ready for actions.

I could do that, but my intention is to mount the double-cock gunlock used on the Constitution:

The detail is too small to include with an SLS casting, so hope my son can make resin gunlocks for these guns once he's settled.

Do you have any idea of what kind of display base they will be shown on?

Right now, none. I originally considered having a single walnut base with the two Victory guns on it. I could extend it and include the Constitution gun, even though it doesn't belong. A plexiglas cover for them starts to get ridiculously expensive for either. I even considered a half section of the Victory gun decks, but the 12-pounder and 32-pounder are on decks two decks apart, and the size would overwhelm my desk. So probably no real detail to the base, no hull side or rigging or breeching cable. These are intended to be desk decorations as much as anything else.

 

[Signet]

Do you have any idea of what kind of display base they will be shown on?

I've been looking at plexi display cases, and am astounded at some of the prices. Then I remembered I got one from Hobby Lobby for a metal battleship model, which I am no longer using:

The size is darn near perfect. The cost: $8.99. Maybe put both Victory guns in this, and get the shorter version ($5.99) for the Constitution gun. Then to make it look better and show off the guns better, either scribe some veneer or thin wood for the bottom, or have staggered deck planks, to simulate the deck. Or I could simply make a new base, with or without the planks, and not use the clear bottom. That would look quite professional.

Considering what they're for, and the cost, I don't think I can go wrong with this.

 

[Uwek]

Your work on "metal" works on the carriage is really cool - I love the result and the way you reached it!!!
I agree with a wooden base inside the plexiglass box - will be a very good way to exhibit

 

[Kurt Konrath]

Your case idea is great, and will look good with a simulated deck underneath.

 

[Signet]

Thank you guys, I appreciate it.

Continuing with the capsquares, rather than a round eye used for a pivot for the Constitution's 24-pounder and (I think) the Victory's 12-pounder, the Victory's 32-pounder uses a long square bar, bent into a U at the top to form the pivot. Although my wife creates jewelry, and does have some square copper wire, the largest size was way too small. However a search of my brass box found some 1/16" square tubing, which is just about the right size. I tried bending it (after heating it with a torch first to soften it), and it didn't work out well. The tubing collapsed during bending. And I knew from trying that I couldn't bend 1/16" square styrene to that tight a bend without it breaking (even after soaking in boiling water). So based on some experience I'd had in bending round tubing, I found some round brass rod that was a snug fit in the square brass tubing:


The result (on the right) was considerably better than without the rod (on the left):

Following the same basic capsquare assembly, of plastic, as used on the 24-pounder Constitution's gun, it came out like this with the square tubing:

I have to sand and touch up the paint yet, but think it's a pretty good representation of the Victory's 23-pounder gun mount. Chain for the keys was delayed, again, so I bent the pins to be used for it so I'm ready when it comes in.

 

[Signet]

The guns are now completed. I'll show photos of the carriages first, so you can compare the details and construction of the HMS Victory's 32-pounder and 12-pounder guns. I'll leave it to you to decide which is which:




The fore axtree braces were made of styrene for the 12-pounder, but brass for the 32-pounder, as I couldn't get thicker styrene to bend enough without cracking. The round headed bolts on the underside are not really correct, but I couldn't figure a way to have rods with wedges and washers to come out right. Plus, they're almost impossible to see when in the case or without picking up and turning over.

Now the completed Victory 12- and 32-pounder guns:






And finally, all three: the USS Constitution's 24-pounder flanked by the HMS Victory's 12- and 32-pounders:



That's it for the gun models. I am starting planning the base for the display cases, as discussed above.