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Le Saint Philippe 1693 after Jean-Claude Lemineur (Ancre) in scale 1:48

Thanks for the encouraging words, guys. This one is going to have some scars and imperfections. I'm trying to work at a high level but there are parts that just aren't fitting the way I think they should. I'd start over but I don't know what I am doing wrong so the next time would be the same outcome. I keep telling myself: most of these mistakes will be covered with planking. A true statement, but a poor way to build a ship model.
 
dockattner said:
Removed. Read the plans wrong if you saw the post...
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Paul, I have been reading plans for city, county, and state bridges for the last 40 years, even now I am doing elevation workups on a consulting basis for my old boss. All this to say my Le Requin Monograph plans are kicking my butt. If I were building this from scratch, it would be torturous. I know you can handle it though.
 
Daniel20 said:
Paul, I have been reading plans for city, county, and state bridges for the last 40 years, even now I am doing elevation workups on a consulting basis for my old boss. All this to say my Le Requin Monograph plans are kicking my butt. If I were building this from scratch, it would be torturous. I know you can handle it though.
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Thanks for the vote of confidence, Daniel. Of course, it's not like I'm the first person to ever build from scratch - but the geometries just don't make sense. Parts made to the 'pattern' don't seem to be the right shape in relation to other parts. I decided to start doing some sanding/fairing. Maybe that will help me envision where I am going wrong.

The good news is that it's only the back end of the ship that I'm struggling with ROTF :rolleyes: ROTF...
 
Stick at it Paul, as I said, nothing can be taken for granted with JLC's plans.Whilst the frame profiles have worked out OK for me so far, the detail of the bow timbers was a car crash which is why I left everything oversize and did LOTs of sanding.

At least you aren't making the bow........
 
dockattner said:
Hello Friends!

A8fter a bit of an internal struggle as to whether or not I wanted to create another build report, here I am back in a familiar spot (but on an unfamiliar side of the forum).

One of my particular flaws is I don’t like to do the same thing twice. My first ship model was a plank-on-bulkhead adaptation of the DeAgostini Vasa. Next, I was privileged to get my hands on the discontinued Lauck Street Shipyard plank-on-frame Kingfisher. If you are familiar with those build reports, you know I am very comfortable modifying/replacing/adding to the kit parts to make the model my very own – scratch building felt like a natural extension.

So that’s one fully rigged 17th century galleon, and one unrigged 18th century swan class admiralty model. Each of these are prominently displayed in my house and are summarily ignored by most everyone who enters ROTF. Good thing I build for the enjoyment of the process rather than the response I get to the final product :rolleyes:.

This current project will be a stern section model of the French warship Saint Philippe – primarily in European pearwood. It will be fully finished on the exterior – and left in frames on the interior (that is, there will not be any planking or build-out on the open interior of the hull).

FAQ

Why a stern section model rather than the whole ship?

Several thoughts come to mind here. First, the entire ship is beyond my current level of experience and knowledge. Mr. Lemineur’s monograph is famously difficult to interpret. Michele Padoan is currently building this ship, and we all know that I am no Michele Padoan. Nigel Brook has started this model in 1:36 but has set it aside in favor of other projects (and we all know that I am no NMBrook). Concurrent with the development of the monograph two builders also completed this ship and a few photographs of those models accompany the monograph but there are no construction diaries. I am unaware of anyone else successfully completing the Saint Philippe in POF (though I am not on many international forums).

Second, I am not really wanting to take on an 8 to10 year project right now. There are other ships I want to build if God allows me to linger…
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dockattner said:
Hello Friends!

After a bit of an internal struggle as to whether or not I wanted to create another build report, here I am back in a familiar spot (but on an unfamiliar side of the forum).

One of my particular flaws is I don’t like to do the same thing twice. My first ship model was a plank-on-bulkhead adaptation of the DeAgostini Vasa. Next, I was privileged to get my hands on the discontinued Lauck Street Shipyard plank-on-frame Kingfisher. If you are familiar with those build reports, you know I am very comfortable modifying/replacing/adding to the kit parts to make the model my very own – scratch building felt like a natural extension.

So that’s one fully rigged 17th century galleon, and one unrigged 18th century swan class admiralty model. Each of these are prominently displayed in my house and are summarily ignored by most everyone who enters ROTF. Good thing I build for the enjoyment of the process rather than the response I get to the final product :rolleyes:.

This current project will be a stern section model of the French warship Saint Philippe – primarily in European pearwood. It will be fully finished on the exterior – and left in frames on the interior (that is, there will not be any planking or build-out on the open interior of the hull).

FAQ

Why a stern section model rather than the whole ship?

Several thoughts come to mind here. First, the entire ship is beyond my current level of experience and knowledge. Mr. Lemineur’s monograph is famously difficult to interpret. Michele Padoan is currently building this ship, and we all know that I am no Michele Padoan. Nigel Brook has started this model in 1:36 but has set it aside in favor of other projects (and we all know that I am no NMBrook). Concurrent with the development of the monograph two builders also completed this ship and a few photographs of those models accompany the monograph but there are no construction diaries. I am unaware of anyone else successfully completing the Saint Philippe in POF (though I am not on many international forums).

Second, I am not really wanting to take on an 8 to10 year project right now. There are other ships I want to build if God allows me to linger…


Why a stern section of the Saint Philippe?

This is a beautiful ship. As a flag-carrying vessel of King Louis XIV she sits alongside the Royal Louis and the Soleil Royal as representative of a special time in French ship-building history. The ornate stern will require my best work and the challenge appeals to me.


Why not simply build plank-on-bulkhead and finish out the interior?

I believe there is much to be gained by forcing myself to learn how to read plans and fabricate parts from scratch. Surely the experience will make future projects more approachable.


Why build to 1:48 scale?

In one sense, a 1:36 presentation would allow me to get the most out of the stern décor. At 1:48 there will be some compromises. But even at 1:48 this is still a fairly large model, and the space necessary to display it is a factor to be considered. Plus, the Kingfisher was built to 1:48 and I think this will be an effective comparison of relative ship size.

To be continued...
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How did I miss your new project?!?!?!

Now following and look forward to another wonderful build and log!
 
BradNSW said:
How did I miss your new project?!?!?!

Now following and look forward to another wonderful build and log!
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Yup. It's quiet over on this side of the forum.

So far there are some really positive moments...and then there is the reality that this very evening I redrew the plans for the most aft frame - for the third time...

I have been doing my best to build 'according to the plans,' but that has not always worked out. I honestly can't say if the plans are off or if my construction is off. The geometries are quite complex and when I move from one monograph plate to the next it is seemingly impossible to reconcile the drawings. Thus far my choice of which drawing to take as gospel has not worked out. Of course, the realization that I am re-working the work of a master in the field is not reassuring. But at this point I'm just doing anything/everything I can to create a faired hull. I'm giving this build another week or two. I'm not a quitter. But I am a recovering perfectionist who can only take so much imperfection.
 
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My apologies to the old and new friends who have followed me over to this project. It has been my habit to share each step of the fabrication with you - often in macro. But right now I am in 'grinding it out' mode and I have not been posting as generously. Please hang in there. If there is a favorable outcome to my struggles you will be the first to know.
 
Whether grinding it out or just taking a break once in a while, nothing wrong with sitting back and watching the world go by, especially in the setting in your yard in post #2. I have taken breaks in actually making sawdust of an hour, a day, a month, and twice for over a year. Rejuvenation is a good thing.
Allan
 
Hey Paul,
I have not seen Lemineur's plans - I've only heard "rumblings" about them. I can say from all of the Monographs I own Delacroix's to me are the easiest to understand. Im not sure if you own LAmarante or Egyptienne - both of those are some of his latest and really nicely laid out and accessible.

Look forward to seeing your next progress update whenever it is !
 
AllanKP69 said:
Whether grinding it out or just taking a break once in a while, nothing wrong with sitting back and watching the world go by, especially in the setting in your yard in post #2. I have taken breaks in actually making sawdust of an hour, a day, a month, and twice for over a year. Rejuvenation is a good thing.
Allan
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Thanks, Allan. Taking a break might be the ticket. In the meantime I'm on a suicide mission to get the framing to flow into the fashion pieces in a way that makes it look like a ship rather than a flotilla of logs.
 
CLB said:
Hey Paul,
I have not seen Lemineur's plans - I've only heard "rumblings" about them. I can say from all of the Monographs I own Delacroix's to me are the easiest to understand. Im not sure if you own LAmarante or Egyptienne - both of those are some of his latest and really nicely laid out and accessible.

Look forward to seeing your next progress update whenever it is !
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Well, Chris, you are now the second person this morning to share a message about JCL's plans, and the third in a week. I am reluctant to add to the 'rumblings' because a first time scratch builder is hardly in a position...

With that said, I cannot deny that I have uncovered some 'inconsistencies' across the plates. Unfortunately, as this build enters its third month, I have also already learned I cannot trust the isometrics or the projections. Perhaps there is a reason there are so few examples of the Saint Philippe across the forums. I will do my best to at least insert a stern section into the void (albeit with some execution errors and other anomalies).

Still enjoying it (sort of).
 
Hope you get things to match up and fall into place, across all the drawings.

My limited experience sez, go with the plan you are most confident/comfortable executing...then during the fairing process sometime the other sheets simply appear to "fall in line" or appear accurately.

Good luck as you visualize, interpret, extrapolate, etc!!!
 
Hang in there Paul. Given your past record I have confidence (perhaps exceeding your own at this point) in your ability to reconcile all the inconsistencies and come up with a perfectly satisfying solution resulting in a typically "Doc Kattner" work of art! Thumbsup
You, as much as anyone are aware of how often I've backed up, undone, re-designed and re-worked aspects of my project in the extreme :eek:. Yet, dissatisfactions aside, I bumble along.:rolleyes:
I figure there is enough there that I am happy with and whoever wants to pick it apart for its' inevitable flaws is welcome to do so after I'm done, dead and gone. ;)
 
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dockattner said:
Thanks, Mike. I’ve been making the dog’s breakfast out of this build this week so some better chairs should open soon. I had more do-overs in the last month than I did in my previous four years of ship modeling. I’ll get around to posting a progress report when I’ve made actual progress. That said, this might all be a Viking funeral.
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Paul, what is the phenomena related to your logs? I make a trip to the bathroom, come back and there are 5 more pages to your log?!? ROTF You'd think since this is a stern build the number of pages would be maybe 1/3 of that of your Vasa. I'm taking wagers 2:1 that it's over 150!!

Now, on the comment of "the dog's breakfast", I seem to recall you comparing the inside of my hull as "dogfood", to which I corrected, "more like the food after it passed through the dog". ROTF

So how is your experience with scratch building so far? What you expected?

Oh, by the way, great work, as always. It's like saying to Rory Mcilroy, "great drive". :rolleyes:
 
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