Vasa is looking absolutely gorgeous! Regarding your problem with turning round to square, I've found it a LOT easier to turn square into round, particularly now that you got your lathe.
Vasa - 1:65 DeAgostini [COMPLETED BUILD]
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Good updates - your log is getting the well deserved huge support as well as tons of good information from other builders - nice indeed.
Wonderful work Paul. Always a pleasure to get back to your log and see the excellent progress.
A word of caution with your channels where they sit closely over cannon ports, and doors - you may well have trouble fitting the below-channel shroud irons as these will need to pass through the channel planks and extend to be secured to the hull. Inevitably these securing points will be close or behind some cannon doors.
This of course will likely only be an issue with the Fore and Mainmast channels as the mizzenmast channel has no cannon ports beneath.
A word of caution with your channels where they sit closely over cannon ports, and doors - you may well have trouble fitting the below-channel shroud irons as these will need to pass through the channel planks and extend to be secured to the hull. Inevitably these securing points will be close or behind some cannon doors.
This of course will likely only be an issue with the Fore and Mainmast channels as the mizzenmast channel has no cannon ports beneath.
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Thanks Peter. The learning curve is a severe one in this hobby! But I'm learning...
I must admit, you are a great and talented student, Mon Amie! You learn fast.
Paul, on the channels, you can pin them, but it’s not really necessary because the chain plates that secure the deadeyes are anchored to the hull, and thus they take the tension from the shroud lines. If anything, that tension should push the channel into the hull. The slots in the channels, the chain plates go thru, prevent the deadeyes and chain plates from creating a moment on the channel, that would want to bend it upwards. Hope that makes sense. But the pins certainly won’t hurt anything!
You are doing a fantastic job on this ship. Keep up the great work!
On masts, I always make 4 lines, the length of the mast at 90 degrees apart to clock everything on the mast. You can use those as a guide to keep the square oriented properly. I usually file them by hand. I also use a vice to squeeze two flats parallel to one another, using the lines as a guide for clocking, squeeze just enough to compress the wood and make the small flats as a guide. Using your four lines as a guide, rotate 90 degrees and clamp again and you have your four flats clocked 90 degrees apart, to use as a guide to finish to size with a file. That’s the no power tool approach.
You are doing a fantastic job on this ship. Keep up the great work!
On masts, I always make 4 lines, the length of the mast at 90 degrees apart to clock everything on the mast. You can use those as a guide to keep the square oriented properly. I usually file them by hand. I also use a vice to squeeze two flats parallel to one another, using the lines as a guide for clocking, squeeze just enough to compress the wood and make the small flats as a guide. Using your four lines as a guide, rotate 90 degrees and clamp again and you have your four flats clocked 90 degrees apart, to use as a guide to finish to size with a file. That’s the no power tool approach.
Thank you Dean. I was tracking with you until this part here (above). If you get a moment could you share a picture of what you are describing?
Ok I cut a dowel to use as an example…
First mark your reference points or lines at 90 degrees apart. I use a circle template for this.
Then I put the dowel in a vice with two of the marks in line with the flats on the vice. You can use a board level with the top as a reference if you wish to be exact.
Now clamp the vice hard enough to create two flats, but don’t be overzealous!
Then rotate 90 degrees and repeat for the next two flats.
At this point you will have four flats at 90 degrees apart. This will be your reference planes or surfaces for your file. Then skate the file level with the flat until you deepen it. If it is not level, one end will be wider. You can measure and adjust. Stop when get to the width of the square you are making. Although I would do a little on each side until they start to join and you have a sharp edge.
Here are the flats after clamping…
After filing…
As you can see it is square, probably not perfect, but done by hand in a about 5-10 minutes.
Hope that helps!
First mark your reference points or lines at 90 degrees apart. I use a circle template for this.
Then I put the dowel in a vice with two of the marks in line with the flats on the vice. You can use a board level with the top as a reference if you wish to be exact.
Now clamp the vice hard enough to create two flats, but don’t be overzealous!
Then rotate 90 degrees and repeat for the next two flats.
At this point you will have four flats at 90 degrees apart. This will be your reference planes or surfaces for your file. Then skate the file level with the flat until you deepen it. If it is not level, one end will be wider. You can measure and adjust. Stop when get to the width of the square you are making. Although I would do a little on each side until they start to join and you have a sharp edge.
Here are the flats after clamping…
After filing…
As you can see it is square, probably not perfect, but done by hand in a about 5-10 minutes.
Hope that helps!
Kurt Konrath
Kurt Konrath
I would assume the “seats of ease” aka Head are open bottom and empty overboard.
Early passenger trains those up till the 70’s had open dump seats as well. That is why they had signs “ do not use in station”. And hobos knew not to stay under a train bridge!
Early passenger trains those up till the 70’s had open dump seats as well. That is why they had signs “ do not use in station”. And hobos knew not to stay under a train bridge!
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now that is skill. I compensate for my lack of skill by using power tools. But, I like power tools so it's all good I guess.Ok I cut a dowel to use as an example…
First mark your reference points or lines at 90 degrees apart. I use a circle template for this.
View attachment 266308
Then I put the dowel in a vice with two of the marks in line with the flats on the vice. You can use a board level with the top as a reference if you wish to be exact.
View attachment 266309
Now clamp the vice hard enough to create two flats, but don’t be overzealous!
Then rotate 90 degrees and repeat for the next two flats.
View attachment 266310
At this point you will have four flats at 90 degrees apart. This will be your reference planes or surfaces for your file. Then skate the file level with the flat until you deepen it. If it is not level, one end will be wider. You can measure and adjust. Stop when get to the width of the square you are making. Although I would do a little on each side until they start to join and you have a sharp edge.
Here are the flats after clamping…
View attachment 266318
View attachment 266319
After filing…
View attachment 266320View attachment 266321
As you can see it is square, probably not perfect, but done by hand in a about 5-10 minutes.
Hope that helps!
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Very usable! Thanks for sharing.As you can see it is square, probably not perfect, but done by hand in a about 5-10 minutes.
Hope that helps!
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Paul, on the channels, you can pin them, but it’s not really necessary because the chain plates that secure the deadeyes are anchored to the hull, and thus they take the tension from the shroud lines. If anything, that tension should push the channel into the hull. The slots in the channels, the chain plates go thru, prevent the deadeyes and chain plates from creating a moment on the channel, that would want to bend it upwards. Hope that makes sense. But the pins certainly won’t hurt anything!
You are doing a fantastic job on this ship. Keep up the great work!
On masts, I always make 4 lines, the length of the mast at 90 degrees apart to clock everything on the mast. You can use those as a guide to keep the square oriented properly. I usually file them by hand. I also use a vice to squeeze two flats parallel to one another, using the lines as a guide for clocking, squeeze just enough to compress the wood and make the small flats as a guide. Using your four lines as a guide, rotate 90 degrees and clamp again and you have your four flats clocked 90 degrees apart, to use as a guide to finish to size with a file. That’s the no power tool approach.
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....What....? ... to early,,, more coffee....Paul, on the channels, you can pin them, but it’s not really necessary because the chain plates that secure the deadeyes are anchored to the hull, and thus they take the tension from the shroud lines. If anything, that tension should push the channel into the hull. The slots in the channels, the chain plates go thru, prevent the deadeyes and chain plates from creating a moment on the channel, that would want to bend it upwards. Hope that makes sense. But the pins certainly won’t hurt anything!
You are doing a fantastic job on this ship. Keep up the great work!
On masts, I always make 4 lines, the length of the mast at 90 degrees apart to clock everything on the mast. You can use those as a guide to keep the square oriented properly. I usually file them by hand. I also use a vice to squeeze two flats parallel to one another, using the lines as a guide for clocking, squeeze just enough to compress the wood and make the small flats as a guide. Using your four lines as a guide, rotate 90 degrees and clamp again and you have your four flats clocked 90 degrees apart, to use as a guide to finish to size with a file. That’s the no power tool approach.
Dean, thank you very much for posting this thoughtfully designed and careful process. My square section is larger than my round section but there is no reason I could not apply this approach once I have tapered the masts (as I showed in an earlier post)...Ok I cut a dowel to use as an example…
First mark your reference points or lines at 90 degrees apart. I use a circle template for this.
View attachment 266308
Then I put the dowel in a vice with two of the marks in line with the flats on the vice. You can use a board level with the top as a reference if you wish to be exact.
View attachment 266309
Now clamp the vice hard enough to create two flats, but don’t be overzealous!
Then rotate 90 degrees and repeat for the next two flats.
View attachment 266310
At this point you will have four flats at 90 degrees apart. This will be your reference planes or surfaces for your file. Then skate the file level with the flat until you deepen it. If it is not level, one end will be wider. You can measure and adjust. Stop when get to the width of the square you are making. Although I would do a little on each side until they start to join and you have a sharp edge.
Here are the flats after clamping…
View attachment 266318
View attachment 266319
After filing…
View attachment 266320View attachment 266321
As you can see it is square, probably not perfect, but done by hand in a about 5-10 minutes.
Hope that helps!
You're welcome Paul. Adding flats after turning helps ensure you only put flats on the larger diameter. Or add the flats in the area you need and then turn the mast down. Either way you're fine!
I'm sure none of you have slept well wondering how Paul will turn round stock into square...so I thought I should give you a brief update.
But first, I want to share my appreciation for the many good thoughts and suggestions (start with square stock / buy a mill / etc.). I will keep those excellent ideas in mind for a future build. Thanks, especially, to Dean who took the time to post his excellent tutorial.
I gave your technique a whirl Dean and it worked pretty well. The aspect that ultimately caused me to keep searching is that my mast blanks are hardwood and I wasn't getting a very prominent flat to use as a guide for the file work.
I ended up with a simple solution that I'll share in case anyone finds themselves in a similar spot.
You have seen my rough turned masts:
I began by sanding one surface flat on a disc sander (shy of the final goal):
I then turned the rod so the flat part was sitting on the guide table and sanded the next surface (perfect 90 degrees with no fuss):
I then repeated those steps on the remaining surfaces and then snuck up on the final position of the square (I wanted the flat area to run perfectly into the round area at the apex of the curve):
Confession: several times I overshot my goal and needed to take the part back to the lathe for refining.
Anyway, not exactly rocket science, but this worked nicely in my hands (and with the tools I have on hand).
One more thing. I mentioned that I adopted Kurt's (aka Mr. Destructo - if you follow his build log you know what I mean) mast tapering technique. Basically he uses opposing sanding blocks to keep the piece from breaking as the lathe spins. Just for fun - here is a proof of concept photo:
The shorter piece is 120 mm of 4 mm stock tapered to 1.7 mm (still need to shape a ball on the top). The longer piece is nearly 200 mm long and tapers to 2.0 mm. Pretty cool.
As I mentioned earlier I am finding tapering these masts to be fantastically satisfying. Maybe there won't be a future ship build - I feel some woodturning in my future!
Thanks for stopping by! As always, I am humbled by your interest in my work.
But first, I want to share my appreciation for the many good thoughts and suggestions (start with square stock / buy a mill / etc.). I will keep those excellent ideas in mind for a future build. Thanks, especially, to Dean who took the time to post his excellent tutorial.
I gave your technique a whirl Dean and it worked pretty well. The aspect that ultimately caused me to keep searching is that my mast blanks are hardwood and I wasn't getting a very prominent flat to use as a guide for the file work.
I ended up with a simple solution that I'll share in case anyone finds themselves in a similar spot.
You have seen my rough turned masts:
I began by sanding one surface flat on a disc sander (shy of the final goal):
I then turned the rod so the flat part was sitting on the guide table and sanded the next surface (perfect 90 degrees with no fuss):
I then repeated those steps on the remaining surfaces and then snuck up on the final position of the square (I wanted the flat area to run perfectly into the round area at the apex of the curve):
Confession: several times I overshot my goal and needed to take the part back to the lathe for refining.
Anyway, not exactly rocket science, but this worked nicely in my hands (and with the tools I have on hand).
One more thing. I mentioned that I adopted Kurt's (aka Mr. Destructo - if you follow his build log you know what I mean) mast tapering technique. Basically he uses opposing sanding blocks to keep the piece from breaking as the lathe spins. Just for fun - here is a proof of concept photo:
The shorter piece is 120 mm of 4 mm stock tapered to 1.7 mm (still need to shape a ball on the top). The longer piece is nearly 200 mm long and tapers to 2.0 mm. Pretty cool.
As I mentioned earlier I am finding tapering these masts to be fantastically satisfying. Maybe there won't be a future ship build - I feel some woodturning in my future!
Thanks for stopping by! As always, I am humbled by your interest in my work.
Try this video...
Or this method
Hi Paul- I slept rather well. Your log and contributions from Dean etc are invaluable to me for when I get to my masts. Thanks. PS it appears I am going to have to invest in some of the magic machinery you have. Admiral may need some convincing tho.
I have a small suggestion, Paul. You might already know this. If you even need to make a sharp step in the yard, or reduce the long taper shown on your spun mast above to a narrower and sharper transition in diameter, use a mill file and slowly draw it with light pressure to shape the wood. Below is an example of what will be a yard arm. The narrow end has a sharp transition that was achieved with many light strokes of a jewelers file. If you try to make hard cuts, the piece will crack at the corner where the section that ride on the center and the narrow part meet. For this yard, the larger diameter part that ride on the center will be cut off and discarded after it is removed from the lathe. You can sculpt wood into detailed shapes if you are slow and careful with the file. You can use a round file for radii or a flat or triangular file for sharp corners. If the work is just too delicate, say at a diameter of less than 3mm, you can avoid risk, take the piece off the lathe, and file the inside corners by hand.
