VOC SPIEGELRETOURSCHIP BATAVIA 1628 - KOLDERSTOK 1:72

Joined
Jan 23, 2018
Messages
1,066
Points
443

Location
Maine, USA
Heinrich,

Excellent explanation of your latest work. I know the “it’s there” feeling. I’m still in the novice builder phase and see all the “mistakes“ in my previous builds. Fortunately when we have company and the ships on the mantle are shown, they see the overall model. “How long did it take to build that” is the most common comment.

Jan
 
Joined
Jan 9, 2020
Messages
297
Points
278

Thank you for kind comments, Jan, and the fact that you enjoy the log. You are right - it's certainly an "it's there" feeling. From the beginning of the build and sticking closely to the advice of one of the original Batavia builders on the Dutch Forum, I have decided to take things slowly and make sure that I do everything as "right" as I possibly can.

Kind regards - Heinrich
 
Joined
Jul 9, 2019
Messages
131
Points
103

So first up was the wulf that needs to be planked with 4mm walnut strips at an angle of 72 degrees.
Can I ask why 72 degrees? Is this just the way the wulf is typically planked or is there an reasoning behind that particular angle? Just a noob trying learn what I can...
 

Maarten

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Sep 10, 2017
Messages
1,673
Points
528

Location
The Netherlands
Hi gents,

In Dutch this is not the wulf but the spiegel, t hhe part above it which is white is the holle wulf, above that with the carvings and the green p l anks is the bolle wulf. Then above that the window section, above that the hakkebord and finally the bovendste hakkebord.

As to the spiegel I expect this was done to get the ends of the planks as square as possible at their connection to the hull planking. This connection at the edges was the weakest to watertighten. Secondly pointed wooden connections are more prone to rot.
With the smaller tucks at the beginning of the 17th century the planks are therefore at a bigger angle then at the end of the 17th century where the tucks become wider and the angle is going to a more 45 deg.
 
Joined
Jul 9, 2019
Messages
131
Points
103

Thanks, @Maarten.
I was thinking I had seen some "spiegels" planked at 45 degrees, so your explanation is helpful. Would that joint at spiegel to hull planking be rabbeted or something other just a butt joint to help seal watertight? I am a huge fan of these Dutch ships, so I'm very thankful for your expertise.
@Heinrich, thanks for the photo of the spiegel on the replica Batavia. Helpful to see that up close on a real ship.
Cheers.
 
Joined
Jan 9, 2020
Messages
297
Points
278

@donfarr : Thank you so much for the kind comments, Donnie. I follow your Rochefort build very closely and must applaud you for your "never say die" attitude. You are an inspiration to me and make me think of a good friend of mine back in South Africa. At age 79, he is still a regular competitor (and a fierce one at that) in SA V8 Modified Saloon Car Championships. When he is struggling with something on the car or engine, his favourite saying is: "It doesn't have a mother or father, therefore, it has to do what you want it to!"
Best Greetings - Heinrich
 

Maarten

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Sep 10, 2017
Messages
1,673
Points
528

Location
The Netherlands
Thanks, @Maarten.
I was thinking I had seen some "spiegels" planked at 45 degrees, so your explanation is helpful. Would that joint at spiegel to hull planking be rabbeted or something other just a butt joint to help seal watertight? I am a huge fan of these Dutch ships, so I'm very thankful for your expertise.
@Heinrich, thanks for the photo of the spiegel on the replica Batavia. Helpful to see that up close on a real ship.
Cheers.
That is just a butt joint.
 
Joined
Jan 23, 2018
Messages
1,066
Points
443

Location
Maine, USA
Heinrich,

Is there an explanation or reason for all those nails in the Gun port doors. I’ve noticed the same configuration on some of the other fine builds here on the forum.

Jan
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jan 9, 2020
Messages
297
Points
278

@Pathfinder65 . Hi Jan, I asked the question on the Dutch modelbouwforum. There doesn't seem to be a definitive answer other than it was probably for rigidity.
 
Joined
Jan 23, 2018
Messages
1,066
Points
443

Location
Maine, USA
Heinrich,

It was a curiosity question, I tried searching the Internet but could not come up with an answer. I’m thinking maybe the design would act more like armor? But then again I’m not that familiar with wooden war ship designs.

Early English Ships, I did find this interesting. Fascinating what was done back then.

Jan
 
Joined
Mar 16, 2012
Messages
113
Points
78

Location
Poland
The keel sticks after hull planking and not before. The rear part must be chamfered to fit the rear beam on which you mount the rudder.
Basic mistakes . Where do you have chamfered frames?
Without literature, it makes no sense to build such a model like this, and then a Dutch school. Deck boards - drama
Sorry

1.jpg
 

Maarten

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Sep 10, 2017
Messages
1,673
Points
528

Location
The Netherlands
The keel sticks after hull planking and not before. The rear part must be chamfered to fit the rear beam on which you mount the rudder.
Basic mistakes . Where do you have chamfered frames?
Without literature, it makes no sense to build such a model like this, and then a Dutch school. Deck boards - drama
Sorry
?????
 
Joined
Jan 9, 2020
Messages
297
Points
278

The keel sticks after hull planking and not before. The rear part must be chamfered to fit the rear beam on which you mount the rudder.
Basic mistakes . Where do you have chamfered frames?
Without literature, it makes no sense to build such a model like this, and then a Dutch school. Deck boards - drama
Sorry


@JScolum: Thank you for your post. Unfortunately, like Maarten, I am at a loss as to the meaning of your post.

1. Can you please say which part needs to be chamfered? I thought you meant that the hull planks need to be chamfered where they join the keel, but you mention "frames" - so not sure what that means. If "frames" are referring to the bulkheads - they will still be chamfered (faired) prior to the hull planking.

2. Lack of literature?

Literature.png

Literature 2.png

3. "Deck Boards - Drama"?

Kind regards - Heinrich
 

zoly99sask

Administrative
Staff member
Administrative
Blandford Group Build
Joined
Apr 13, 2015
Messages
4,961
Points
588

Location
Saskatoon,Canada
The keel sticks after hull planking and not before. The rear part must be chamfered to fit the rear beam on which you mount the rudder.
Basic mistakes . Where do you have chamfered frames?
Without literature, it makes no sense to build such a model like this, and then a Dutch school. Deck boards - drama
Sorry


@JScolum: Thank you for your post. Unfortunately, like Maarten, I am at a loss as to the meaning of your post.

1. Can you please say which part needs to be chamfered? I thought you meant that the hull planks need to be chamfered where they join the keel, but you mention "frames" - so not sure what that means. If "frames" are referring to the bulkheads - they will still be chamfered (faired) prior to the hull planking.

2. Lack of literature?

View attachment 140264

View attachment 140265

3. "Deck Boards - Drama"?

Kind regards - Heinrich
I highlighted the post you quoted,much more visible
 
Top