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Le Saint Philippe 1693 after Jean-Claude Lemineur (Ancre) in scale 1:48

dockattner said:
Hello Friends,

Having test fit the lower deck beams I was able to begin installing them along with the (now fitted) beam knees. During this installation I was able to re-install the rider frames.

You will see a space between the vertical portion of the beam knees and the hull. The knees would ordinarily be fitted to the planking on the inside of the frames, but that planking is absent on my model (thus the space). Nevertheless, I still added mounting bolts to the knees which is sort of nonsense given the space but...

View attachment 574937

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Next, I added the carlings (oddly, these longitudinal elements are placed at the vertical center of the beams rather than flush with the top of the beams) along with the dovetailed coamings and centerline spacers. These latter elements are only roughly fitted at this point - the joinery will need to be improved before final installation - but that can't happen until the ledges are fitted (also with dovetails). This will all make more sense when I show the installed ledges (probably in a week or two barring the unforeseen).

View attachment 574941

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The French design makes deck fabrication tedious - my respect to people who are building full size ships and are choosing to include these details. The thought of doing this work for the remaining four decks is daunting - even on my stern section model.

I appreciate that you have taken the time away from your own work to visit.

View attachment 574943
Click to expand...
A very nice alignment of those tint parts, Paul. A lot of measuring and fitting.
Regards, Peter
 
dockattner said:
Hello Friends,

Having test fit the lower deck beams I was able to begin installing them along with the (now fitted) beam knees. During this installation I was able to re-install the rider frames.

You will see a space between the vertical portion of the beam knees and the hull. The knees would ordinarily be fitted to the planking on the inside of the frames, but that planking is absent on my model (thus the space). Nevertheless, I still added mounting bolts to the knees which is sort of nonsense given the space but...

View attachment 574937

View attachment 574938

View attachment 574939

View attachment 574940

Next, I added the carlings (oddly, these longitudinal elements are placed at the vertical center of the beams rather than flush with the top of the beams) along with the dovetailed coamings and centerline spacers. These latter elements are only roughly fitted at this point - the joinery will need to be improved before final installation - but that can't happen until the ledges are fitted (also with dovetails). This will all make more sense when I show the installed ledges (probably in a week or two barring the unforeseen).

View attachment 574941

View attachment 574942

View attachment 574944

View attachment 574945

The French design makes deck fabrication tedious - my respect to people who are building full size ships and are choosing to include these details. The thought of doing this work for the remaining four decks is daunting - even on my stern section model.

I appreciate that you have taken the time away from your own work to visit.

View attachment 574943
Click to expand...
Hi Paul, are you using your mill for most of these notches or are you using small chisels or both (I am assuming the later). Very precise work. Re the spaces between modelers will add extra dimension to the knee to compensate for the lack of planking. I know I will need to do that on the unplanked side on La Renommee for rigidity. Leaving the space works well to on your model !
 
BradNSW said:
Those dovetail joints are incredible!!

I see the bolts going into the (imaginary planking). Gives new meaning to "hanging" knees:D! They look great and it was a good choice to include them!

Question: Did the plans show bolts on the knees (parallel to the keel) which connected them solidly to the beams?

I placed them on my Bonhomme Richard build (photo and sketch below).
View attachment 575002View attachment 575003

Your work is simply stunning. Somehow, I never get alerts to your post, even though I unwatch and rewatch every time I visit. I will continue to check your log, in the hopes of new post/photos!
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Hi Brad,

Yes, I am aware of the notifications problem on our forum. No worries.

While my plans are (as far as I can find) silent on the question of bolts joining the knees to the beams they obviously would have been there. I have left them off as any bolts in those locations would be obstructed (fully or partially) by the pending ledges. Of course I can still add them as needed if I discover they are visible in some locations. Thanks for keeping me sharp!
 
GrantTyler said:
Good morning Paul. Brilliant as always. Man you have thought of everything and willing to have the patience to include them. E.g. the spacing on the vertical knees where the inner planking would be. Respect. I don’t know how you achieve such perfect notches and dovetails but they make wonderful viewing.

Yep me too. It’s OK with Paul because I don’t forget to check his work out:D.
Cheers Grant
Click to expand...
Thanks, Grant. I'm trying to include as much eye candy as possible given the unique viewing opportunities possible on this section build. That said, in the middle of fabrication, I find myself thinking, "you sure you want to spend the next year of your life building decks, Paul?"
 
CLB said:
Hi Paul, are you using your mill for most of these notches or are you using small chisels or both (I am assuming the later). Very precise work.
Click to expand...
Hi Chris,

I am using a small V gouge to cut the female end (on the beam) - and a #11 blade for the notches on the male end (on the spacer/coaming). It's delicate work for sure (especially when I am working on the beams which already have much time invested in them). I suppose I could cut the male end on a mill but I can't imagine how to do the female end there. Anyway, the problem with my approach is uniformity (plus I am working at the limits of the pearwood) so sometimes I need to accept my outcome and move on.

CLB said:
Re the spaces between modelers will add extra dimension to the knee to compensate for the lack of planking. I know I will need to do that on the unplanked side on La Renommee for rigidity. Leaving the space works well to on your model !
Click to expand...
I believe your planned solution is the accepted standard though I have also seen several models doing it the way I am. Once I committed to having the rider frames float I was more or less committed to this approach.
 
Herman said:
Great work on this lower deck. Fantastic precision job.
The carlings on one side are lowered into a slot. I assume you made a hole into the deckbeams by drilling and further using a small chisel for the fixed side of the carlings?
Click to expand...
You have it right, Herman. Drill a hole and then square it up with chisels. The slot on the other side is easier and faster (and more uniform as it was done on a mill). Of course things run off line sometimes but I hope the overall look will be acceptable.
 
dockattner said:
While my plans are (as far as I can find) silent on the question of bolts joining the knees to the beams they obviously would have been there.
Click to expand...
I'll take this opportunity to respond to my own posting ROTF.

Brad had asked what the plans said about something... You can see part of my response to him above...

As a novice to scratch building (and a relative newcomer to ship modeling) I have encountered several issues:

1. the detail I am looking for is in the monograph (or on the plan sheets) but I can't find it.
2. the detail I am looking for is in the monograph (or on the plans sheets) but I don't understand what I am looking at.
2. the author assumes I should know how to do something if I am building a warship of this size from plans.

I have run up against each of these - often at the same time. Every possible detail is not on every drawing. So I look and look and look checking other plates to see if the detail I am looking for is included somewhere (ANYWHERE???). One time I was trying to figure out how to build a sill - looked everywhere without success - and ended up following the approach a modeling master took. @NMBROOK wrote to me gently explaining I did it wrong. He pointed me to a particular drawing and voila - there it was! How could I have missed this?!?

And then there are other times when the author is clearly assuming certain knowledge and experience on the part of anyone using his monograph - so it seemingly never occurs to him that he should explain such and such a thing. But then he will go on for pages about some obscure detail that isn't even a part of the model - just some arcane nugget about French naval architecture from the seventeenth century... How about we cut this discussion short and you tell me what bolt size to use!

I'm not really complaining. I'm a big boy who knew I was out of my depth when I started this model. I'm just wanting to provide some perspective for others wanting to move in the direction of scratch building.
 
Hey Doc, between working at nights on the ship and posting online during the day, do you have time to work on teeth! Ha Ha, the work is great and I enjoy looking at how nice it can all come out when patience is used while working.
 
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